To many missiles inbound!

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:18 pm

I am happy the combat is not as easy as in other space sims, but I think the enemies use to much of their missiles. Every bloody encounter with enemy fighters, expecially the Vonari, is a missile-fest, I'm constantly evading 3/4 missiles. I can't get into an attack position and firing my missiles is not going to solve my problem: i have only an Aries with 4 hardpoints.

First, how many bloody missiles per ship have the Vonari?

Is there any trick to it?

I'm not a newbe as far as evading missiles is concerned. I'm a Falcon 4.0 veteran and there is only that: missiles.

This is becoming frustrating. Please advice.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:37 pm

Yes, mostly the Vonari but also other enemies use firing missiles as a tactic to keep you at a distance to avoid getting into a dogfight. Vonari also can have eight missiles. But because they fly in thight formation it looks like one or two ships, but when you get close you can see it is really a group of 3 to 8 fighters shooting missiles at you, so it can look like they have more missiles. If you press the G key on your keyboard you can get a list of the enemies in your Target Status Box so you can tell how many fighters in the formation your targeting. So you destroy some till you have 1 or 2 left and then you go in and shoot the missiles they fire at you down and then you will be able to get in to a dogfight! with 1 or 2!;)

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:56 pm

So for the Vonari the best tactic is:

Step 1: Long range attack with missiles against an enemy pack.

Step 2: Closing, firing at missiles.

Step 3: Dogfight.

The problem is: currently I have only 4 hardpoints. I'm playing as a military pilot doing only military missions in the Sierra War zone. Is a hard life. I hope with Wraith it gets better.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:11 pm

Yes, if you want to practice dogfighting!;)
And it will be easier if you have 8 hardpoints with an Excalibur pack installed for elemination purposes to have 1 or 2 left for dogfighting!;)

warsign · Post by **warsign** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:36 pm

Yes, with excalibur, you will get a big advantage to attack them or destroying them.

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:38 pm

The navy doesn't pay me that much!

I can barely afford any missile that doesn't cost more than 30.000. That means that I need to save them for critical situations since they pay me only 100.000 per mission.

I hope that once I advance in ranks my pay will raise as well.

warsign · Post by **warsign** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:49 pm

Originally posted by Koranis
The navy doesn't pay me that much! I can barely afford any missile that doesn't cost more than 30.000. That means that I need to save them for critical situations since they pay me only 100.000 per mission.

I hope that once I advance in ranks my pay will raise as well.

More waypoints, more credits. You can earn much much more in warzones. Try 5 ways. After purchasing Excalibur of course

Or you can try them in Mp with others.

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 3:22 pm

But is it my impression or the enemy behave as if there was only me? Everytime the entire armada give up their previous targets and get on me. It's seems silly.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 3:29 pm

The Vonari are cowards in that respect!

Yes they go after the easiest targets, new players and lower ranks!LOL:P

So if you are the lowest ranking in Multiplayer, they all concentrate on you!:P

Many times in MP I had it happened that when a lower ranking player entered all my enemies mysteriously dissapeared only to find them all heading towards the new player!:P

[Edited on 6-24-2009 by Maarschalk]

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 3:50 pm

Are you serious?

Anyway it seems to be a common behavior of all AI ships.

Besides... in single there is no comparison between the ranks, am I right? No matter how far I'll advance, I will always carry the bullseye on my fronthead....

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:04 pm

Actually, combat with 4-6 reds or Vonari can be boring! Yawn!
I admit, it may seem daunting at first, but once you get the hang of it, it's really quite easy. It's just "tactics" and you must learn them.
One tactic has been suggested by Eclipse and that is by going in reverse and keeping the missiles in front of you allowing them to be shot down.
Another is to attack at high speed at an angle rotating your ship as you pass to keep the missiles from locking.
There are many more, but they have to be tried and experience & patience are the best teachers.
P.S. Don't forget to use CM's, but only when the missiles are behind or at an angle to you.
Good Luck!

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:10 pm

I'm already using those tactics, many of those that do not rely on inertial speed worked also in Falcon 4.0....

And I exhaust CMs in the first minutes of combat. I should start to actually fire at those missiles instead....

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:22 pm

If you are using up all your CM's early in the fight it's possible you are using too many at a time and you are not using them wisely.
You must get the missile at the 3, 6 or 9:00 position for them to have any affect.
But like I said, practice makes perfect.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:33 pm

Originally posted by Koranis
Are you serious?

Anyway it seems to be a common behavior of all AI ships.

Besides... in single there is no comparison between the ranks, am I right? No matter how far I'll advance, I will always carry the bullseye on my fronthead....

Yes, and it is a common behaviour of all AI enemy ships!
to be cowards to target the easiest enemy target! and the last question answer is yes and no. You make alies as you advance and your alies will help protect you other then that you will be the bulls eye in single player, that is why there is an advantages to playing in MP;)

[Edited on 6-24-2009 by Maarschalk]

verbosity · Post by **verbosity** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:10 pm

Originally posted by Koranis
Besides... in single there is no comparison between the ranks, am I right? No matter how far I'll advance, I will always carry the bullseye on my fronthead....

Actually you'll find a change in attitdue in SP ( not in MP though), they will spot you and fly in to attack, if you have enough of a rank and an well equipped ship they might turn round and flee, or even bribe you to not kill them!!!!

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:30 pm

That's COOL!

Anyway, I might be wrong, but in Arvoch Conflict I rarely find myself in the sights of all the enemies on the scene. Often I have to chase an enemy fighter that sticks to my wingman's tail!

[Edited on 6-24-2009 by Koranis]

Nigel_Strange · Post by **Nigel_Strange** » Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:57 am

OK, I think I need to step in here.

First of all, the enemy AI never really seem to run out of missiles. I was going with a red AI a while back and I counted at least 20 missiles from the same ship. It wasn't even Vonari. So, where's the secret base where I can have 20+harpoints installed?

Second: the enemy AI can immediately lock and launch as soon as you appear. This goes for jumping in, warping in, or decloaking.

So, between having an apparently limitless supply of missiles and the ability to lock and fire instantly, they already seem to have an advantage.

Additionally, Vonari missiles have a quirky behavior in which they seem to fire indirectly, so that these drunken missiles move around tangentially before homing in on you, making them harder to shoot down.

How to counter?

1. Get excaliburs. You really can't afford to fight missile to missile against limitless hordes of missiles unless you get them.

2. Keep your speed up. NEVER slow down in combat. If you keep your speed at or above 3000 units, you should be able to avoid most missiles.

3. Wait for the missiles to get close before you let a CM go, then let three or four go. If you're going fast enough, you might not need to use them.

4. Learn to shoot down enemy missiles. I usually switch to particle-only so the laser does not drain my energy too much.

5. The enemy AI do seem to be weak in a dogfight, if you know what you're doing. If you approach laterally, you can usually hit them without them hitting you (much). However, you will be tempted to get into a furball and that means you'll be slowing down. When that happens, you're an easy mark for other enemies, so do your pass, then get well out of range before you turn around for another pass.

Well, those are my tactics. They're probably in the tactics help file, too, as well as more.

[Edited on 6-25-2009 by Nigel_Strange]

DennyMala · Post by **DennyMala** » Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:44 am

The enemy ship that fired more than 20 missiles might have had excalibur mounted.

When I have a red in range the locking process takes no time as I'm already facing the targed (same as when you appear on a scene and they target you).

Never saw Vonari missiles so I'll not comment on this..... but it seem a strange behaviour for a missile that have to impact.... it can be more easy to dodge if it goes that way. Simply close the turn to get on its side.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:53 pm

The drunken missiles are missiles that can not get a lock on you for some obvious reasons like em emmissions from certain counter missiles, you flying on inertia only.........etc!;)