Nav map

Elvisman2001 · Post by **Elvisman2001** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:05 pm

Is there any way that scrolling the nav map around could be added in so that you can move it around once your zoomed in?
It sure would help in being able to find locations.
If there is one thing that isn't very user friendly, it is the nav map.

Maybe like a "hold right mouse button down and drag" to move it around or something?
Perhaps some sort of "search box" where you can type in the name of the location you're looking for and the nav map will center on it if it exists or is discovered or logged? Something. Anything.

Cougar_DK · Post by **Cougar_DK** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:08 pm

Yeah thats one of my wishes too.... Maybe a higher resolution map as another option to the F1. The new map would fill the screen completely and only be for navigation. I have a hard time to read the texts since the font is so big (fat) and the different objetcts is close.

Just an idea.

Elvisman2001 · Post by **Elvisman2001** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:42 pm

Originally posted by Cougar_DK
Yeah thats one of my wishes too.... Maybe a higher resolution map as another option to the F1. The new map would fill the screen completely and only be for navigation. I have a hard time to read the texts since the font is so big (fat) and the different objetcts is close.

Just an idea.

yes. being able to have a whole screen dedicated to just a NAV map would be welcome as well. the nav map is pretty important and needs to be refined a bit imho.

I am also having a very hard time reading the text (even with the textual options) and finding things with the current setup. To me, the small square on the hud should be nothing more than the sector map and everything else should be on an entire full screen/interface that could be brought up.

[Edited on 2-8-2009 by Elvisman2001]

Cougar_DK · Post by **Cougar_DK** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:08 pm

Sorry for asking but what textual options?

49rTbird · Post by **49rTbird** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:12 pm

You can turn text off or have it show different things such as just planets or stations things like that.

Winter Owl · Post by **Winter Owl** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:18 pm

While we're wishing for improvements, it would be great to have some means of knowing whether a selected jump point is within my current fulcrum drive's range. I know it isn't difficult to estimate just with trial and error, but time is money when I'm transporting passengers.

ShaggyMoose · Post by **ShaggyMoose** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:35 pm

Yeah, I am kind of disappointed that the navigation map didn't see more changes. It should be drag-scrollable, with free zoom and larger. Maybe these things interfere with how Vice wants to present the UI, but right now the limitations of the map are interfering with my use of it. I know which one I would prefer to have.

Cougar_DK · Post by **Cougar_DK** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:37 pm

Originally posted by thetiebers
You can turn text off or have it show different things such as just planets or stations things like that.

Hehe....thought maybe it was possible to change the text size or the like

:D

Cougar_DK · Post by **Cougar_DK** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:39 pm

Originally posted by ShaggyMoose
Yeah, I am kind of disappointed that the navigation map didn't see more changes. It should be drag-scrollable, with free zoom and larger. Maybe these things interfere with how Vice wants to present the UI, but right now the limitations of the map are interfering with my use of it. I know which one I would prefer to have.

Yeah, if it was a "stand alone" map without any of the normal transparent GUI, i.e not possible to see space, it would IMHO be a great aid.

tha_rami · Post by **tha_rami** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 6:22 pm

Personally, I'm a great fan of the UI. I love how it does not pause or interfere with the game, it would be hellish to plot a jump point while under fire if the map covered everything.

verbosity · Post by **verbosity** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 6:36 pm

Originally posted by ShaggyMoose
Yeah, I am kind of disappointed that the navigation map didn't see more changes. It should be drag-scrollable, with free zoom and larger.

well you can already zoom out further, part of the liimitations in place are there for gameplay aspects, it should be possible to blind-jump, and scrolling/zooming out/ seeing further would reduce this.

Beyond that I aggree with rami, one of the reasons its not been changed is that this is the most effective display system thats beeen come up with so far, thats suits as many people as possible. Myself? I'd love the nav map to work in a more 3d way rather than the 2d system at the moment, but no-one has ever suggested a workable system for this ( to my knowledge, even nasa has issues with such a problem)

Seeing as the nav map has come up a few times, I'll stick my 'google-maps-style' evochron map a little higher up my to-do-list.

tk7223 · Post by **tk7223** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:01 pm

I can see that 'scroll-ability' would be something I'd make a lot of use of. And a simple thought on Fulcrum range- would it be difficult to have your map-nav marker turn a different color for out of range plots? Just a thought off the top of my head....

tha_rami · Post by **tha_rami** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:10 pm

Scrollability useful? Why? You can zoom out until the maximum visibility range already.

Winter Owl · Post by **Winter Owl** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:46 pm

Originally posted by tha_rami
Scrollability useful? Why? You can zoom out until the maximum visibility range already.

Say I want to plot a jump far away, near the limit of my level 5 fulcrum. And I want to plot it with a high degree of precision at the same time. Right now, the nav screen makes that very difficult, because I can either zoom out for long range or zoom in for precision, but not both at the same time. If it were scrollable, I could leave the map zoomed in and scroll over to whatever point I'm aiming at. Or better yet, use the long range view to plot a point in the general area, then zoom in on that plotted point to fine tune it

Of course, it's possible that the system is deliberately designed with this limitation in mind in order to prompt players to make good use of the map point logs.

Speaking of map logs... wouldn't it be great to be able to sort them in various user-defined ways? To create groups? I could have a group for found hidden goodies, another group for good fields to mine, another group for places that buy the things I mine, etc. Or maybe it would be better to sort them by location. That would be very useful.

Hate to sound like I'm complaining, because I very much am enjoying the game. Just a few suggestions to make it even better.

tha_rami · Post by **tha_rami** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:49 pm

Oh, but you can rightclick on your destination sector and zoom in on it

.

BraveHart · Post by **BraveHart** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:50 pm

Originally posted by tha_rami
Oh, but you can rightclick on your destination sector and zoom in on it .

"Ha Ha Ha....I was just thinking that"

Elvisman2001 · Post by **Elvisman2001** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:52 pm

Originally posted by tha_rami
Scrollability useful? Why? You can zoom out until the maximum visibility range already.

Because it's more intuitive? And, it would be easier to read?
Maybe I don't want to have to zoom out and then when i do, for me, it is still hard to read everything and get my bearings. if i could just drag or scroll the map while i'm zoomed in, it would make things much easier. A button on the interfrace so i can center back onto my position would be nice too.

And why would having a full screen nav map interfere with you being able to plot a jump point in battle if the full screen was something separate you could bring up while keeping the one you have now in the cockpit?

If there is one thing holding this game down, its some elements of the interface.

[Edited on 2-8-2009 by Elvisman2001]

Winter Owl · Post by **Winter Owl** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 8:00 pm

Originally posted by tha_rami
Oh, but you can rightclick on your destination sector and zoom in on it .

Thank you very much. I missed seeing that.

So much to learn! This game is huge.

axisAdamWest · Post by **axisAdamWest** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 8:22 pm

Originally posted by verbosity
Seeing as the nav map has come up a few times, I'll stick my 'google-maps-style' evochron map a little higher up my to-do-list.

this would be really nice. I can't see how anyone could possibly be against being able to just drag and scroll the map around? I can use the sector zooming just fine and I can easily get to wherever I want to go, but it's considerably more clunky and disorienting than a smooth drag to scroll would be.

Goatnado386 · Post by **Goatnado386** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:44 pm

Same, same. I'd like a NavMap where left-click & hold lets you scoot it around instead of placing a navpoint.

Post by **Vice** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:44 pm

Yes, I think the right click option is occasionally missed, it's a very useful option for zooming in on any sector quickly and precisely. And it's also useful for locking the nav point to an object in space.

There are some systems that are very dependent on the 3D-to-2D conversion routines for gauging position with the mouse cursor across multiple sectors, which would make implementing a sliding system pretty tricky. But I'm not against the idea in concept.

Couple of thoughts. It could be a bit tricky keeping track of your original sector position relative to any distant sectors you might scroll to once you slide it off the screen. Also, how would you want such an option to be enabled? The left mouse button is used for manual plotting, right button for icon locking and zooming, wheel for zooming, and signals 3+ don't respond on many systems in windowed mode. I could add another button on the right side of the console to enable it, but then you'll be selecting a mode on, sliding the map, selecting it off, then clicking to select a nav point, which would be quite a bit slower and less efficient than just zooming in on the sector you want with a right click, then plotting the point. Nav maps are often a challenge and can take some time to learn, but this version seems to be fairly easy for most players to manage. I'm not sure sliding it around would help much in terms of ease-of-use, but as a secondary way to move around, it probably wouldn't hurt. I'll keep it in mind.

[Edited on 2-8-2009 by Vice]

Daedalao · Post by **Daedalao** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:09 am

middle mouse or perhaps a ctrl+click? I'm against the idea, but it would be interesting to see.

Skiiwa · Post by **Skiiwa** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:42 am

I like the Idea..I thought elite did it quite good..Eve's map works well also. Eve style Map wouldnt work in this game I think..How bought a double click to lock target and click and hold to scroll map? that way U will not need a new key binding?

Winter Owl · Post by **Winter Owl** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:00 am

Disregard all I said earlier. I'm happy with zooming to a distant sector with right-click.

But I also like the notion of middle-click and drag to change the perspective. Drag up and down to change from top view to rear. Drag right and left to rotate the whole map.

tk7223 · Post by **tk7223** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:04 am

Does the mouse wheel 'click' have a function already? I tried it and it didn't seem to do anything in map mode. If not that might work, seems like most of the pc's i've been on have that feature. If it's a major programing change, then I'd say it's functional just as it is-and this would just be candy for me.