EL - Engineer officer: Proposed change - Emergency ability.

[Rubber Chicken]

So... After getting my Cent-not-so-sure-ian (see what I did there? ) shot to pieces with 10% hull, 3% engine, 43% weapons, 60% nav systems and a destroyed Repair Sys. C3, I had to limp 650K (distance) back to the station.

While I was enjoying this leisurely flight at 7K (speed), I got to thinking that the engineer should be able to repair at least some of the internals of the ship without a repair system present.
Even if the engineer can only repair subsystems partially (for example) to get the jump drive back online or have some guns to cover your retreat with, or kick the television so the radar/nav functions clear up a bit, that'd be great.
The repairs wouldn't have to be 100% it would have to be just enough to save the ship and reduce excessively long travel times to get to a safe base.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not talking about the engineer being changed into an instant savior, there should still be some time where the chance of getting vultured at your weakest has you working the controls, and hoping, and praying your ship won't be wasted. The engineer's emergency ability will simply help keep that time from potentially being a multi-sector inertial run at top speed if you end up in a similar scenario as the one I described.

I was thinking that an engineer with less than a skill rating of 60 could be able to repair subsystems (to a capped limit) at a rate comparable to 1/4 that of a C1 Repair Sys.
An engineer with a skill rating greater than 60 would be able to work at 1/2 the speed of a C1 Repair Sys.
If any type of Repair Sys. was equipped, the engineer's 'emergency ability' would not stack and repairs would happen at the current in-game rate. Any buffs to the repair system the engineer currently provides (as of version 1.0308) will still apply.
The maximum engine subsystem value the engineer would be able to repair would equal getting the afterburner and jump drive back online.
If the jump drive unit has been destroyed, then obviously only the afterburner would be brought back to functionality. At that point - if you still want (or need) to save your ship from destruction and you have far to go, then good luck to ye.
Max weapon repair would be ~60-70%. That way you'd have slightly better than 50/50 chance squeezing the trigger will actually do something.
Max nav would be ~60-70% as well - or whatever is enough to make the HUD a bit more legible.

I think this would be very good for those of us who prefer not to use the self destruct button and try to save the ship regardless of how crippled it is. It would also give people a chance to run and save their ship if they've gone a long time without saving and have just reached an important milestone in their in-game goals. After all, coming to a dead stop in hostile space in order to save will probably result in multiple AI ambushes when one's heavily damaged ship respawns at the next session. This would also be a great help to those who'd like to try their hand at a 'dead is dead' play style

Even though it could be argued that the other types of officers could provide some sort of ship-internal 'emergency buff' as well, I'm not really looking at starting a long-running idea thread here. This is only about the Engineer and a suggested change.

I just want to see how many people think this specific idea is worth enough merit to see if Vice might consider tweaking it for best effect then adding it.

[Marvin]

What happens if the engineer gets killed?

[Rubber Chicken]

What happens if the engineer gets killed?

I haven't seen crew get killed, so I'll ask.... Is there currently a chance of crew dying in-game?
If so, I'd say at that point you'd be dealing with the original scenario I described.

I'm not saying that the possibility of having to use your last good limb to drag yourself miles to safety should be completely eliminated. I'm saying that the engineer should be able to make some internal repairs to reduce the chance of that stage happening.

Currently it's kind of like living with a doctor, getting cut, and the doctor saying "It's not my job to apply stitches. Here's your bill!"

[DaveK]

An engineer clambering around the Jeffrey Tubes with his bag of spanners and a hammer! It's sort of like having a C0 repair module with a cap. Since an engineer appears to speed up the repair function when a repair module is installed, it suggests that he ought to be able to do somewhat more than press a 'go faster' button that only engineers are allowed to press.

I quite like the idea of using crew to provide (very limited) back up so that players don't have to spend hours limping home or bale out and reload. Perhaps a Weapons Officer could get the guns back on-line just a bit faster. It would enhance immersion - the other crew could keep the engineers supplied with coffee!

[AcePalarum]

I like this idea a lot. The current situation would appear to be that when you hire an engineer, he skips the part of the want ad that says "must provide own tools". And I know that if I had an engineer on board who couldn't fix things in-flight, at my next stop I would be buying him a full set of tools so I could feed them to him.

So yeah, I think having the engineer earning some part of his keep without the shipboard repair system running would be great.

[Vice]

Indeed, the repair system is the toolset for ship repairs. So it has been required in repair operations. As a possible alternative, the engineer could be made to repair at a very slow rate and/or subsystem damage only, leaving hull repairs for manual repair at a station/city.

[Rubber Chicken]

Indeed, the repair system is the toolset for ship repairs. So it has been required in repair operations. As a possible alternative, the engineer could be made to repair at a very slow rate and/or subsystem damage only, leaving hull repairs for manual repair at a station/city.

Yes. That is what I'm getting at. The Repair System allows for both internal (subsystem) and external (hull and external parts of the engine, weapons, and nav. array) repairs.
I propose that the engineer could carry out some repairs on internal components of the subsystems should the Repair System be destroyed. The maximum amount of the repairs that could be carried out to said subsystems wouldn't even have to be 100% - to account for components needing to be accessed by external panels and the like.
For example, the Engine Subsystem already has a minimum value that it must be intact (something like 76%) in order for the Fulcrum Drive and afterburner to function. The engineer could make repairs to that extent, and nothing more.

The engineer's 'emergency ability' would only activate if the repair system was completely destroyed - you'd have to procure another one - and the emergency ability's repair rate would not stack with a functional repair system.
Like I said in the OP, the current perks the engineer gives to a functional repair system would remain the same.

I'm glad to see support for this idea.

Fly safe, guys.

[WeirdWill]

Subsystems sounds good to me! As long as it doesn't become effective in combat as am alternative to the repair system.

[Rubber Chicken]

Subsystems sounds good to me! As long as it doesn't become effective in combat as am alternative to the repair system.

Agreed. The idea is to do just the bare minimum to allow you to run for your life until the subsystems (mainly engine subs.) are repaired enough to bring the jump drive back online and give some last resort weapons, targeting and nav. functionality. Then you can return to base without a possible hours-long journey.
Obviously, if the jump drive has been destroyed, then I hope you brought along a good book. lol.

On the up/down side depending if you're a mil or civ frame pilot... Mil frames have no crew, so a destroyed repair system and damaged engine subs. = taking the long way home. I don't think that this should be changed.

[Marvin]

Obviously, if the jump drive has been destroyed, then I hope you brought along a good book. lol.

The new manual on pirate behavior and SOP should suffice.

[Rubber Chicken]

The new manual on pirate behavior and SOP should suffice.

I've been thinking about this. I know I shouldn't assume things, but it seems to me that you're trying to compare this idea to the very complicated '3rd/IND faction thread'.
I see some of your point, but the difference is that this idea is directed towards the flight sim/technical side of the game, not the social/political sim part.

[DaveK]

The new manual on pirate behavior and SOP should suffice.

I've been thinking about this. I know I shouldn't assume things, but it seems to me that you're trying to compare this idea to the very complicated '3rd/IND faction thread'.
I see some of your point, but the difference is that this idea is directed towards the flight sim/technical side of the game, not the social/political sim part.

I think that Marvin was just commenting that the manual for the pirate/IND suggestion will be a big book and hence suitable to pass the (extended) time as you limp back to base.

[Rubber Chicken]

Perhaps your right DaveK, and I did read a bit too far into it. But, you could possibly draw a parallel to the two threads in terms of adding more to the manual regarding both technical/flight systems sim and reputation/political sim areas of the game.
Granted, the politics pages would be far greater in number.

Anyway, any opinions - Should this thread continue on the original topic, or have we gotten all that can be had out of it already?

[DaveK]

Perhaps your right DaveK, and I did read a bit too far into it. But, you could possibly draw a parallel to the two threads in terms of adding more to the manual regarding both technical/flight systems sim and reputation/political sim areas of the game.
Granted, the politics pages would be far greater in number.

Anyway, any opinions - Should this thread continue on the original topic, or have we gotten all that can be had out of it already?

My opinion on the subject: I'd be very happy to have an engineer help out more directly for those occasions when I'm beaten up having acquired something important and hence don't want to reload. I'd want him to add a small boost even if the repair module was still working. It would of course depend on being able to escape the source of the beating up - not something to be taken for granted! It's a good incentive to actually carry an engineer. I'd even provide a hammer and some spanners (and for the UK branch) a sonic screwdriver

[Marvin]

To widen the subject matter ... the more options which are assigned to the engineer or navigator or even to one of the modules: good idea. It gives incentive for hiring a crewman or using up precious metal in building a module. But it would require proper documentation. Already we have too many posts asking what "this" does and what "that" is for. The answers should be part of an official manual, included in the game download.

[Rubber Chicken]

To widen the subject matter ... the more options which are assigned to the engineer or navigator or even to one of the modules: good idea. It gives incentive for hiring a crewman or using up precious metal in building a module. But it would require proper documentation. Already we have too many posts asking what "this" does and what "that" is for. The answers should be part of an official manual, included in the game download.

Agreed.

On a *sort of* aside.... I've always envisioned the Repair System as a unit that produces and controls nanobots that can crawl all over the ship and repair broken circuits or hull holes by either welding them together or sacrificing themselves to fill the empty spaces. For example: The ship's hull has a 10 inch gash in it from combat. First the nanobots 'clean ' the edges of the gash to facilitate bonding new material to the area. Then they fill the hole in sufficient numbers to create a new piece of hull plating and superheat themselves to 'melt' into place. A secondary team of bots then cleans the surface of any excess welding slag and reclaims the material for future use. The Repair system then recovers all active nanobots, repairs and recharges them, then sets to work manufacturing more to replace the ones lost to filling the hole in the hull. The bots are then stored in the unit until needed again.

IMO it's a bit of a good thing that the Repair System doesn't have it's own sub-slots that require fuel and materials to keep it operational or need to draw from cargo supplies. I suppose there's a point where even though it would fall into the technical part of the sim, it could become "too technical".
I'm sure that's one of the challenges of a lot of player requests - balancing enjoyable game play with technicality without skimping on both.

@DaveK: As I've already stated, the current-version advantages the engineer already gives the Repair System (already in the manual) would remain unchanged if the new emergency perks were added.

[Marvin]

I'm always in favor of nanobots. How they go about procuring the carbon (or whatever) to do what it is they do ... well, that's a mystery to me.

[Crow]

I love the idea of repairing subsystems over time. It would be great if the navigator could bring the navigation system to the brink of totally destroyed once you get out of a nebula as well.

It feels like I've hired Talby from Darkstar