Mining vs Trading

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 10:14 pm

I admit, I have forgotten how user unfriendly trading really is in this game. I am little disappointed that there is still no real stock here and that you depend on whatever trash the local market throws on you. After a long trip to a planet/station, you land and then realize that on what had to be an agricultural market, the only items on sale are textiles, hydrogen and fusion reactors - all items that on the right market would cost even less.

Now, it wouldn't be a problem if there was a way to fast forward in time to get the right items, but as it is I am forced to take off again and search for another opportunity. Really frustrating.

I realize that it makes trading more challenging and thus more rewarding, BUT, while I'm writing this I am comfortably sitting in an asteroid field and mining gold, diamonds and platinum. Then I will sell them on the nearest "T" planet at full price. No wandering in space for a couple of credits.

I'm sure there are some gold-mine trading routes, but I am still a new to this game and I ask myself why I should bother looking for them if I already have a gold mine in my reach right off the bat.

Am I missing something? Am I doing something wrong? I really would like to trade instead, but it's simply not fun....

(sorry i didn't mean to complain even if i DID...)

ChazFox · Post by **ChazFox** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:20 pm

Well, it depends on what you're trading. I remember back on Legends I resorted to arms dealing to make my money. XD Fulcrum Torpedoes make quite a bit of cash if you know where to sell them. XD

BraveHart · Post by **BraveHart** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:24 pm

"It get's better as you explore and don't forget to make things out of the items you collect"

Post by **Vice** » Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:29 pm

Trading is kind of geared toward a multi-point, high effort for higher potential reward structure. You're certainly not limited to only having to dock at one point to search for something in a desired economy type for many locations, there are usually orbiting stations and even other cities within the same economic zone type. And although I don't want to give too much away, I will say that even short trips from certain locations to certain 'ground' locations can even provide a healthy profit percentage... in the same system. You can obviously do ok mining, but many of the biggest pay-offs are a result of finding the high end trade routes, many of which involve learning where the various economy types and levels are, then learning what that means for specific items and inventories. From there, it's pretty much just a matter of putting the pieces together to come up with trade runs that make excellent profit.

Things are also pretty different in the game compared to Legends. As an example, there are certain systems/conditions that can result in Metal Ore being worth more than Platinum, especially for what it can be used for and how it can the traded.

[Edited on 9-19-2010 by Vice]

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 9:20 am

So if I understood correctly, I'm doing everything right, I just lack the knowledge of the "trade". Basically you mean that for example the station around Richton may offer different commodities than the city on the planet' surface.

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:26 am

Not all stations pay the same amount for the same thing. The plan is to try to find who pays how much for what. And don't forget that items might be worth more in other systems as well.
This requires some "exploring" but once a reasonable trade route is found, Voila!

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:20 pm

Originally posted by Vice

Things are also pretty different in the game compared to Legends. As an example, there are certain systems/conditions that can result in Metal Ore being worth more than Platinum, especially for what it can be used for and how it can the traded.

[Edited on 9-19-2010 by Vice]

************Spoiler Alert**************************

LOL I discovered this first hand with platinum....took it to a construction station and lost on profit big time.....

:P:P:P:P
For 25 units it gave me a probe worth only 3,000 credits....

:P:P:P

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:31 pm

It is difficult for me to ask it, since I've been playing "space trading" games for years (Elite 1&2; Privateer 1&2; all X iterations; Freelancer)... so it makes me feel really a newbie, but this game really does... so what is your approach to the matter? Do you buy in one place and then explore the space looking for the right price? Or are you exploring beforhand, and then trade on a well scouted trade route?

Usually this type of game offer a kind of aid for gameplay purposes, like approx stock information accessible right of the bat, or details economic system information. It lacks in X, but I know that if I go to a mining system I will find that kind of goods there, not an entire cargo of wheat at a low price (that would be even lower in a agricultural system).

I can't tell you how many times I found Hydrogen, Fusion reactors and Textiles on sale on Sapphire....

ANOTHER TOPIC of this thread is Mining, however. Don't you think it's overpowered? I mean, after 4 mining runs I could afford a new ship, or completely refit my current one with the latest technologies. It is so easy compared to trading, or even Equipment Cleaning, since it takes approx the same time but the rewards are much much higher, that it seems to me only viable way to get rich enough to do as I please (ie. go to a War Zone as an ultimate badass).

[Edited on 9-20-2010 by Koranis]

Ravenfeeder · Post by **Ravenfeeder** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:36 pm

You'll make a darn sight more money trading than you'll ever make mining. Think out of the box a bit. You might find equipment to be a good trading item. The most I've been able to make mining is around 700k a run. On the other hand, I found an item of equipment, buy in one system, sell in another, instant 2m profit. There's supposed to be a location where you can buy FTs for around 700k, which I haven't found yet, you can resell FTs for over 4m in other locations - fill up your cargo bay, plus your weapon slots, that's 13 slots - very nice profit. You can also buy a station licence at the location you buy stuff from, 25 per cent reduction in costs, which equals 25 per cent increase in profit.

Do some exploring first, note the price of items, even missiles. Look at the everyday items you can buy, and then turn into something else at a construction yard. You can re-sell the construction yard stuff at a good profit. Anti-matter is a very good, and cheap buy, if you can find it. You can get anti-matter by blowing up a cap ship and tractor beaming its cargo into your hold. I found a planet selling anti-matter, took it to the construction yard, turned it into something else, can't remember what, and sold it at another planet for a 2m profit. If you look at the Legends instructions, you'll find a full list of what materials transform into something else, at a construction yard - I don't know if the list is out yet for EM.

I note that most players, in MP, are concentrating on doing missions. That's fine, you can gain military rank, and gain reputation, even make some money, maybe even enough to cover your missile, and fuel, bills. But, in this game, money talks. Money gives you the freedom to do, and go, where you want, in what kind of ship you want, it also increases your civilian rank. In fact, you can make LEGEND, just by accumulating enough money, around 6bn.

6bn may sound a helluva lot, especially when you are first starting, but, believe me, it isn't. In EL, many pilots were running around with over 50bn. There's a lot in EM, but, you have to work to find it.

Good luck.

soulsacrifice · Post by **soulsacrifice** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:44 pm

Exactly what Ravenfeeder has just said!

Mining is a good way to make some money early in the game but as you progress trading will become more important. Although I think trading in weapons is wrong, we must do what we can to fight of the Vonari, it is a neccessary evil and it is where the money's at!

Early on I will travel from station to staion and buy anything that I can get that is cheap to buy, jump to another station and sell the things that are profitable/buy stock that is cheap at the second station. It is a good way to make money while you are checking the prices for the items and moving to the next station. If the station has antimatter units then I can buy them for next to nothing and convert them to fuel converters. Then it's just a matter of finding the station or city that gives the best price.

If anything, i'd argue that it was too easy to make money in Legends and there wasn't enough to spend it all on. I know Mercenary has a lot more things to spend it on (like building stations and buying missiles to destroy them) but I still think i'd like it more if you had to scrape by to earn a living in space (they are in the middle of a war afterall).

[Edited on 9-20-2010 by soulsacrifice]

Blackthorne · Post by **Blackthorne** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:54 pm

It's pretty hard to generate a money sink that won't cripple the more casual players while still affecting the more hardcore crowd. I'm not even sure if that would solve any problems, as opposed to generating new ones.

Complex systems are prone to failures and exploits. And the harder you try to fix them, the more likely you are to introduce new weak spots.

Besides, I enjoy not having to worry about cash.

-Blackthorne

Post by **Vice** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 5:04 pm

Do you buy in one place and then explore the space looking for the right price? Or are you exploring beforhand, and then trade on a well scouted trade route?

I would generally recommend the latter, so you know what to hunt for and where to go before taking a chance on an unknown variable.

Usually this type of game offer a kind of aid for gameplay purposes, like approx stock information accessible right of the bat, or details economic system information

That'd be the news console. As soon as you arrive in a new area (planet or solar system), you can open the news console and view the market ticker, showing the commodity values of all items in the area, even if they aren't currently available for sale. Combine this with the economic type data provided and you can quickly get an idea of what's valuable and what's not. For most charted systems, you can also get additional details that can sometimes be useful in the 'System Information' section.

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:03 pm

What was Licence about? What do I get if I purchase it? A discount?

Thanks to all for instructive response! I feel like a Trader already

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:24 pm

Read the manual ! if you buy a License it will protect you from being fired upon while docked. It will also offer you a discount on items purchased, but will pay less for items sold.

Koranis · Post by **Koranis** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 8:43 pm

RTFM

I deserved that

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:55 pm

LOL........So one way to make it in a Hostile system is by a License at one of the Stations.......so you have a save haven to jump to when things get rough......

:P:P:P:P

Whytephyre · Post by **Whytephyre** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:08 am

I like to trade; auto CM launchers, anti-missile systems, fulcrum torpedos, excaliburs missile systems, & constructors purchased in the pearl system, from a couple of different stations at random, to Novachron station in Lost rucker.

It is a really short, profitable trade run. 15-35 mil so far on a regular run.
Not bad for 3-6 minutes of effort.

[Edited on 9-21-2010 by Whytephyre]

Post by **Marvin** » Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:42 am

Best thing about a license in a Moderate or Hostile system is you don't pay a large docking fee each time you want to accept a new contract.