Hello, and looking for more stats, and have a few comments/questions

[ChaosShadow00x]

First, I'd like to just say hello to every one. I've been playing the demo and mostly messed around in training mode. Totally picking up the game when I get the coin, but for now I'm just sitting on it.

Now onto the topic. One thing that's seriously bothered me is the lack of vital statistics, mostly mass, actual acceleration, and other various bits of info. Chaises are a particular lost spot, since its unclear how much they weigh... The Saber and Raven are absolutely deceptive being so small but apparently weighing so much. And a game that takes so many details, from every little thing. The thing that bugged me was when I got the tiny little saber frame, and then nothing I did would make it more efficient then the starter frame I had to begin with.

I kinda feed on stats and kinda feel naked no knowing them. So I'm just wondering if there's anything out that that will sate my thirst for knowledge. Also, knowing how things effect each other would be a useful thing. Such as the mass to thrust ratio.

A few comments... Something that's been buggering me is that, as you upgrade your equipment, they only take 1 path of progression as they get more expensive. Wouldn't some things get better in 1 area, and fall off in another, and what not. Having the next upgrade, just be purely better, feels limited. What reason is there to NOT just get the next laser, or fulcrum drive? Each one jumps farther, each particle weapon hits harder and eventually fires faster.

One thing that doesn't quite follow the pattern, but follows its own progression alittle more strictly, is the chaise's... Each one after the next is more expensive, can fit more parts, is less agile, and is heavier. It feels more like, where do you wana stop payin for the next rig, rather then which upgrade is for you. From what I've heard, the last 2 aren't even worth it because they're so heavy and immobile.

The only thing I'm really worried about is that, eventually, there's no point in buying new gear, because in the end its all the same. Once you have the highest grade, that's it, and there's no reason to invest in anything else because its all less then what you own.

One thing I'm curious about, is the Stealth Device... I'm quite interested in it, and since I've never found one, could some one tell me how it works? (and how expensive it is)

Of course, more questions and comments will arise, but for the moment I've emptied my brain. Anything useful for info and any help you can point me at will be appreciated...

Great game, and I'm certain I'll be seeing all of you eventually.

[49rTbird]

Hello ChaosShadow00x, welcome to the forum and the Sim.

[Vice]

I kinda feed on stats and kinda feel naked no knowing them. So I'm just wondering if there's anything out that that will sate my thirst for knowledge. Also, knowing how things effect each other would be a useful thing. Such as the mass to thrust ratio.

Overall functional ('vital') stat information for ships is displayed at the top of the shipyard screen (things like speed, hardpoint count, cargo, fuel capacity, etc). Component stat information is displayed on the bottom left window (which also includes bar graphs) and ship frame stat information is displayed on the bottom right window. Details like thrust-to-weight information for a given design could probably be added, although it wouldn't likely provide any useful information since the result of real-world speed is already shown. But I did draft a spec sheet for the Evoch-C, there may be a link to it floating around somewhere or if not, I can probably find and it post it.

Something that's been buggering me is that, as you upgrade your equipment, they only take 1 path of progression as they get more expensive. Wouldn't some things get better in 1 area, and fall off in another, and what not.

Not necessarily, especially with purpose built components and inter-dependent design considerations. I know some games combine multiple functions into one part that only installs one way (or at most, a few ways), so you basically get one component that operates several things and all you do is pick the part that does what you want.

By contrast, lets compare the shield system in Evochron. Rather than just having one part that controls all aspects of the system, you get to choose 3 separate and functionally unique components to effect how well or poorly the shield system on your ship works. First, there's the frame, which sets the raw power your ship can provide to the shield core. Then you select which shield core you want, each one can provide better protection, but each one is also limited by how much power you feed into it by which frame you select (this is where things can get better or worse depending on your configuration/design selection, not just which part you pick). Then once you've established the frame and core, you select boosters, also known as the capacitors, which determines how much power you can store and for how long. The combination of these factors determines the level of impact your ship can sustain and how well it can recover/recharge lost energy displacement.

Combined with these primary function factors, you also have to consider how the components you select will impact other systems on your ship, including engine, cargo capacity, fuel capacity, and wing/thruster system. Each frame offers a certain level of assembly resources that you can deplete from one design element to give to another, so you must balance your design with your preferred preferences in all of these areas.

So when you are designing your ship, you need to think on multiple levels, not just which part does what on finite levels, but how that part will interact with both your frame selection, other parts you install, and what kind of secondary component setup may apply.

What reason is there to NOT just get the next laser, or fulcrum drive? Each one jumps farther, each particle weapon hits harder and eventually fires faster.

Simple, the next laser doesn't fire as fast and consumes a lot more power. This can leave you vulnerable in various multiple target situations. A more rapid fire cannon that uses less energy can be much more effective in such situations. What you'll need to do is watch for those stats I referred to above. The yield, firing rate, and energy consumption is indicated in the inventory console as your holding the mouse pointer over a particular cannon. Fulcrum drives are a different component, where you'll generally want the longest range you can get. Each component class can vary in its functionality range in multiple areas. Exploring for and learning those variations is part of the game.

One thing that doesn't quite follow the pattern, but follows its own progression alittle more strictly, is the chaise's... Each one after the next is more expensive, can fit more parts, is less agile, and is heavier. It feels more like, where do you wana stop payin for the next rig, rather then which upgrade is for you. From what I've heard, the last 2 aren't even worth it because they're so heavy and immobile.

Maybe, but that's subjective. The only way you'll know if that's the case for you is if you buy it yourself and fly it yourself for the role you want to play. If you're goal is a heavily defended/armored transport ship and the role you want to play involves shipping/transporting/trade, you may find one of the top two civilian frames a good fit... or at least something you want to buy and store for other times when you want to complete those types of objectives.

The only thing I'm really worried about is that, eventually, there's no point in buying new gear, because in the end its all the same. Once you have the highest grade, that's it, and there's no reason to invest in anything else because its all less then what you own.

You can play that way, it is freeform after all, but the result will be you won't last long in online battles and the roles available to you in the game (online and offline) will be compromised/limited. Players that think 'gear is all the same' generally haven't found the 'other' gear and never bother to try it because they think just like you described above... then they wonder why they have such a difficult time in the game and can only complete a handful of objectives. My advice to you is don't limit yourself like that. Take the time to learn the nuances of ship design and how each component/system class operates. You will likely find a configuration you prefer to use most of the time for a given objective/role, but that formula is often not ideal for other roles in the game and you'll want to switch things around as your mood or interests change as you play.

One thing I'm curious about, is the Stealth Device... I'm quite interested in it, and since I've never found one, could some one tell me how it works? (and how expensive it is)

Depends on which kind. There are two types of stealth devices in the game, hardpoint-installed single use devices and reusable equipment devices. One provides a stealth field at just about any time in a one time use device that installs on a hardpoint. The other provides a reusable stealth field, but requires all shield arrays to be at full power as it uses those arrays to create the stealth field, rather than generating it internally like the other device. It also depletes your main energy, which requires recharging after you 'decloak'. So each device has its own advantages/disadvantages and installation/use requirements.

As for pricing, that varies. It will depend on what the local economy is like at the time and what kind of reputation you've earned with the local faction(s) offering the device. Plan on it being one of the more expensive things you buy in the game though.

Of course, more questions and comments will arise, but for the moment I've emptied my brain. Anything useful for info and any help you can point me at will be appreciated...

If you don't mind spoilers, consider the strategy guide for a good resource of information: http://starfighter.home.att.net/evochro ... lguide.htm A lot of detailed information about the game is available in the guide, but also some hidden things, so you may want to avoid sections 3-5 if you prefer the challenge of finding things out on your own.

Great game, and I'm certain I'll be seeing all of you eventually.

Welcome aboard.

[Edited on 6-7-2009 by Vice]

[ChaosShadow00x]

Hey, thanks for the reply Certainly shed some light on a bunch of things. I did take a look at the guide before I posted, that's where I got the idea that things were linear progression.

Simple, the next laser doesn't fire as fast and consumes a lot more power.

So, I read the chart wrong? The way I'm reading it is that the cycle rate was the time between shots, and each next particle weapon had a lower cycle rate(which would mean faster fire) and each still hit harder. I wasn't sure of the power consumption, but this is something that I didnt see, and one of those important bits of left out information.

For a more specific question about stats. What is the energy capacity of the different frames, and their contribution to the shields? I'd guess that the bigger frame, the more this would increase, but by how much? I have a feeling theres alot of calculation that goes on behind the scenes that I'm unaware of... For instance, I was partially unaware (I did read, but saw no evidence of this) that your frame was more then just a block with assembly points and armor, but contributed to other various things as well.

As for mass, how exactly do I judge the agility of a build once every thing is said and done? Its certain that the heavier frames are gana have more of a problem gettin around, but what wings and engine would one have to buy to balance things out a bit, and how much does it matter. From what I can tell, the rank 10 engine IF you could throw it on a tallon is a speed increase of 180 (of maximum IDS speed) compared to a rank 1. From a logical stand point, that's the most increase you'll ever get out of an engine unless I've missed something. And from what I can tell, that speed mentioned, translates into acceleration (since physics says that your maximum speed in a no friction environment is directly related to acceleration, and I'm assuming that its the same...) And for the wings, I have absolutely no standpoint of knowing how much they're working at all, and the chart in the guide was kinda unclear (and abit tough to read too, should condense the text)

What I'd want to know from this, is what is the acceleration rate? The top end isn't as much of valuable information as knowing how fast I can obtain it (to me).

I kinda feel like I should point out that I'm not raggin, I'm just trying to get an understanding of whats going on behind the curtains. From which, I hope to obtain a better understanding of what I'm getting when I buy that next frame, engine/shields, or set of wings.

EDIT:

oh yeah...

Originally posted by thetiebers
Hello ChaosShadow00x, welcome to the forum and the Sim.

Thanks

[Edited on 6-8-2009 by ChaosShadow00x]

[Edited on 6-8-2009 by ChaosShadow00x]

[Maarschalk]

Hi ChaosShadow00x, Welcome to the Forum, and I hope you'll get the full version soon and hope to see you out there!;)

[Vice]

So, I read the chart wrong? The way I'm reading it is that the cycle rate was the time between shots, and each next particle weapon had a lower cycle rate(which would mean faster fire) and each still hit harder. I wasn't sure of the power consumption, but this is something that I didnt see, and one of those important bits of left out information.

Not everything is given away without effort and/or trial and error. Some things you will need to find out by playing the game and testing/trying out various elements in it. Generally, the higher class weapon, the more power it uses. Yes, you may be reading that guide wrong as well. The cycle rate is roughly how many rounds fired per minute, not time between shots (that is, cycle rate = firing rate).

For a more specific question about stats. What is the energy capacity of the different frames, and their contribution to the shields? I'd guess that the bigger frame, the more this would increase, but by how much? I have a feeling theres alot of calculation that goes on behind the scenes that I'm unaware of... For instance, I was partially unaware (I did read, but saw no evidence of this) that your frame was more then just a block with assembly points and armor, but contributed to other various things as well.

The assembly resources indicated for each frame are not merely a limitation of space available to components, but also the power available to them. With a higher assembly rating comes more available power overall. So you can use that as a general guide for an idea of the power available to a ship's systems. So what you'll notice is that a Pulsar offers a slightly higher level of power/resources versus a Talon while the Leviathan offers 250% more.

As for mass, how exactly do I judge the agility of a build once every thing is said and done?

If you want the raw numbers, review the 'Effectiveness of Wing System Upgrades' chart in the strategy guide which gives you a break down of the agility provided by various wing/thruster systems installed on each civilian frame type, including comparison bars. It's pretty clear (aside from perhaps said font legibility) in terms of the calculations used. A base agility factor is also provided in the shipyard descriptions for each frame that you can use to gauge for comparison. For real world observation, simply fly the ships to test them.

What I'd want to know from this, is what is the acceleration rate? The top end isn't as much of valuable information as knowing how fast I can obtain it (to me).

Ok, since you asked I will try to spell out the calculation below in clarified/simplified terms:

For 'normal' acceleration using the game's default universe scaling system of roughly 1 unit = 1 meter, the calculation looks like:

accelerationcap# (thrust limit) = (0.95+(engineclass*0.01))*framemassfactor#
accelerationlevel# = (selectedvelocity#-currentspeed#)*0.1+0.001: ' verify result is within cap tolerances
speed# = speed#+((accelerationlevel#*cargoweightfactor#)*frameratetimeroffset#)

That's a representation of how it is determined taking into account frame mass, engine class, difference between selected velocity and current velocity, and cargo weight. When the afterburner is activated, the additional thrust is generally about a 40-50% higher value.

I kinda feel like I should point out that I'm not raggin, I'm just trying to get an understanding of whats going on behind the curtains. From which, I hope to obtain a better understanding of what I'm getting when I buy that next frame, engine/shields, or set of wings.

Totally understandable and reasonable. You're just after a very high level of detailed information, hopefully the above sheds some light on what you're after in regards to acceleration.

[warsign]

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