Why isn\'t this game on Steam?

noxxle · Post by **noxxle** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:02 am

Just curious. The MP population would probably skyrocket if it was.

Mysterius · Post by **Mysterius** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:37 am

Would be a gigantic pool of players and money

.
But i guess they have drastic acceptation rules.

tk7223 · Post by **tk7223** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 12:03 pm

Just guessing..but Vice can keep his hands on this much better by controlling sales on his own site.

verbosity · Post by **verbosity** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 12:33 pm

I could be wrong here.....

I once brought this up a while ago ( around about Evochron Alliance time ), in short Vice had tried to contact Steam to enquire about it, but it never came to much. I've got a couple of contacts who've worked for them, and they said they'd try and get me details, and I sent a couple of enquiring emails ( not mentioning sw3dg or the game itself ) but never got a reply.

spelk · Post by **spelk** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 2:08 pm

I would have thought it might cost a fair bit to be hosted on Steam's digital distribution system, not to mention having to comply to their acceptance requirements, and whether they think it would be financially lucrative.. You'd certainly get a lot more exposure for the Starwraith games to the gaming public.

Perhaps trying something like Stardocks less well known Impulse distribution system could be a better/cheaper option? Or you could then look towards Reflexive/Amazon or Bigfishgames style distribution (but they mainly host casual games not space combat simulations).

A way to increase exposure would be to get review copies in to a number of the very popular indie sites such as

Tigsource
Bytten
GameTunnel
Indiegames
GameTrove
Indie Game Mag
Harry Balls

No doubt there are plenty other indie sites.. but you know exposure on these sort of sites would be a start, it was a very welcome sight to see Evochron Legends mentioned on Rock, Paper, Shotgun

Anyway, just a thought.

Mysterius · Post by **Mysterius** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:04 pm

Steam takes between 40 and 50% of selling prices according to some developpers who have their game on it.

The advantage being the big pool of potential buyers.

Zenith · Post by **Zenith** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 9:01 pm

I doubt Valve will have any interest in hosting an indie space sim on Steam, and even if they did, the price tag would likely be much more than the current $24.95. In my personal experience, Steam is very expensive; games that I've bought elsewhere have been more than 50% cheaper than the same game available through Steam.

I think Vice should stick to his current game plan, keep SW games on the SW site, but he could try and get the word out via review sites such as those Spelk suggested. That's bound to get a few people interested, and it's how I found the series in the first place.

Daedalao · Post by **Daedalao** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 1:14 am

When I get home, I'm going to write a review of Legends and post it to my Impulse blog. I may keep things relative to my interests in the game... Which has a lot to do with the underlying mechanics, ie orbits, unique jumps (if I can get ahold of verb), the features... Also the unique developer support and a few other things. I'll post it on these forums to get other user input once I'm done.

Evil Bones · Post by **Evil Bones** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:03 am

Originally posted by Zenith
I doubt Valve will have any interest in hosting an indie space sim on Steam ...

They hosted a medieval RPG that I'd consider to be indie - Mount & Blade. It was started by a guy and his wife. It's got some pretty sweet mechanics to it too. I got it when it was on sale for $7.50 during one of their weekend sales, which landed it on the front page of "Steam Update News" or whatever it's called.

I think this game needs to age a bit more before it goes to Steam though. It has yet to reach its full potential.

Zenith · Post by **Zenith** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 5:07 am

Indeed, I've had Mount & Blade since the beta version, so I know about it being on Steam. The difference however, is that TaleWorlds signed up Paradox as a publisher, and Paradox sorted out a deal with Steam.

[Edited on 15-2-2009 by Zenith]

Daedalao · Post by **Daedalao** » Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:11 am

Mount & Blade is also available on Impulse. In my opinion Impulse is the less intrusive of the two services.

noxxle · Post by **noxxle** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:35 am

Putting this on steam would probably be a good investment in the long run. Even if the next Evochron is not on steam, at least many more would know about the series.

And the MP.... If the MP population became substantial, people are more likely to tell their friends to check it out (imho). Games that have strong MP communities tend to have lots of mods supported by the community. A large community working on mods helps generate interest in the game.

noxxle · Post by **noxxle** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:06 pm

Originally posted by Daedalao
Mount & Blade is also available on Impulse. In my opinion Impulse is the less intrusive of the two services.

That is true, and Impulse may not take as big of a share of the profits as steam. However Steam can promote the game to a much bigger audience.

Perhaps the developer of EL can get the best of both worlds by having some kind of deal where EL is available exclusively on Impulse for the first 2-3 weeks. After the exclusive deal expires, let Steam sell to whoever hasn't already purchased from Impulse.

The game has already been out a week, most who are familiar with the series have already purchased from the developer anyway.

Perhaps we can get a comment from the developer? How does he/she feel about putting this on Impulse or Steam?

Daedalao · Post by **Daedalao** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:10 pm

Part of the problem with making the game available on Impulse is that Stardock prefers to have all updates pass through it. This causes more headaches than anything else. With direct control over the availability of his builds, I have to be honest and say that I prefer this method. Although steam and impulse would make updating much easier. And steam would force updates upon people

Post by **Vice** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:41 pm

Perhaps we can get a comment from the developer? How does he/she feel about putting this on Impulse or Steam?

Comments below.

Why isn't this game on Steam?

Certainly a reasonable question

What is Steam's (Valve's) answer to that question? If you get an answer, you'll have received more than I have.

Steam and Impulse are distribution and DRM 'services' owned by private businesses... they are not public services open to anyone interested in posting games. They don't offer their service as an open platform, they are closed much like consoles are closed platforms. Only the titles they pick and choose will appear on their 'platform'. It is true that they have accepted a few indie titles, but the ones they've accepted are generally 'casual' games, either arcade/action or logic/puzzle themed games. To publish an indie space-sim would likely be quite a departure for either of them (perhaps even viewed as competition for other developers they do publish games for).

I can't say if this game will ever appear on either platform, it's not really up to me. But in the meantime, you get the benefits of the current registration option for the game. You get a permanent key that you can install the game with, you do not have to access the internet every time you play (nor do you have to specially configure the game for an 'offline' mode of some kind), you do not have to rely on the reliability of someone else's service to play the game you paid for, and you don't have to run a background 'service' program unrelated to the game you paid for.

Word of mouth is probably the biggest help to making small indie games known that get little or no coverage by other means.

starblade · Post by **starblade** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:50 pm

Vice is right, we the players know what a quality product this is. It falls to us to tell those we know about it. I have already informed dozens of the game and previewed it at a gaming conference.

Make your voice heard, it's like voting, you have to actively say something or no one knows.

tha_rami · Post by **tha_rami** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:53 pm

Mount and Blade, amazing game. I bought it waaaay back, through their website. Supporting indies, after all, is important. They're the backbone of creative game design nowadays.

spelk · Post by **spelk** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:04 pm

I'm not sure about getting reviews done by indie game sites, I think perhaps they'll want complementary copies of the game to review it... but as someone who does write personal reviews about games, and who participates in a number of online gaming communities, I've certainly tried to "spread the word" about the Evochron games, and I will continue to do so. I'm assuming these games have got to where they are today, because of the effort put in by StarWraith, but also by the community built up around it.. and to be honest, Vice, you haven't really made a bad job of it.

Since I jumped into the new game, I'm still talking about it, and your community, and your very "personal" approach to development and consideration for your playerbase. So I'm sure with enough 'word of mouth' attention, you'll see this game and the future games ahead flourish and become stronger more innovative titles.

If I can suggest anymore indie web sites that are likely to be interested in your games, I will.

Coming at it from a co-operative play - highlighting the multiplayer aspects, there is a very good site that has a database of co-operative games, might be worth a look.
Co-optimus.com

Wargamer.com have a section dedicated to war gaming in outer space..

Evochron Renegades has an entry on GameTrove, it might be worth updating it with Legends.

Drip feeding these and other indie sites news releases about the games, keep them at the top of the pile and give maximum exposure, but obviously you don't want to over egg the pudding.

Just a few more thoughts...

[Edited on 17-2-2009 by spelk]

noxxle · Post by **noxxle** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 12:56 pm

Why isn't this game on steam yet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:22 pm

Is there a review site for this game, where we could post our reviews and possitive feedback?, this might help!;)

noxxle · Post by **noxxle** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 3:25 pm

I've put off purchasing this game because I am afraid the MP scene isn't very active, but I know if it was on steam the scene would really pick up. What I think Evochron needs is simply more attention. Not from us fans, but from the major review sites.

http://www.gamerankings.com/pc/957946-e ... index.html doesn't even list a single review for Evochron Legends! Perhaps we should all write to the major review sites and express our interest in a review for EL.

piper · Post by **piper** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 3:51 pm

Originally posted by Vice

you do not have to access the internet every time you play (nor do you have to specially configure the game for an 'offline' mode of some kind), you do not have to rely on the reliability of someone else's service to play the game you paid for, and you don't have to run a background 'service' program unrelated to the game you paid for.

Plaezase keep it that way! Do you see all the fuss over Rise Of Flights (WWI flightsim) business model? You have to connect to their server to even play offline. No internet connection, no play. Not fun..

tha_rami · Post by **tha_rami** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 4:06 pm

Its not probable for this game to reach Steam. Steam really is reserved mostly for the games that start out big and have a potential of catering large audiences and honestly, (non-arcade) space simulations usually just don't do that.

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 8:59 pm

Whay not ask "Steam" why this game is not on their list. Don't ask Vice. He would love it to be listed. Ask Steam! Put pressure on Steam! Complain, Demand, and insist!
Then see what happens...

Sironin · Post by **Sironin** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 9:06 pm

As someone whom is currently pursuing legal action against Steam, I can say I'm quite happy I found Vice's games through his website rather than Steam.

Steam doesn't permit users to roll back their games to earlier versions. While Vice is extremely quick and responsive about updates and fixes, it is nice having the option to go back to an earlier version.