What kind of new cloaking device would you like to see?

Post by **Vice** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:03 pm

Please vote for the direction you would prefer most. Comments welcome. For those of you who read the forum, but do not participate, please send me your vote via e-mail as usual.

Note: the original cloaking devices will be kept as an option for players who want to give up a secondary hardpoint for a one time use device. This is specifically for a new kind of optional device that can be installed as an equipment component.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:32 pm

/me votes for option number five.

I'd definitely like a continuous cloak to be available, and I think everyone can see how overpowering it would be if you could cloak/decloak constantly.

Option number five seems to make the most sense, from a realism and fairness standpoint.
If you come out of stealth mode and immediately attack, you'll be toast, basically. (or fried to a crisp, depending on whether you prefer bacon and eggs.. )

Keeping the entire ship surrounded by a stealth field would surely require massive amounts of energy.
And the pulse required to activate the stealth field would probably require so much energy that the entire shield array system would have to shunt it's energy into the field.

And since the ship's energy would be concentrated on maintaining the stealth field, it couldn't very well recharge the shields, now could it?

*sits back and waits for logic to be smashed apart*

Klingon Kahless · Post by **Klingon Kahless** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 12:06 am

Number 4 would keep in tradition of a Cloaking device for the Klingon's Bird of Prey....

Shield energy is needed for engaging a cloak that is continuous.....both shields and cloaking are forms of defense but you can't have both at the same time unless you use the current stealth missile system.

Chikara · Post by **Chikara** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:18 am

Having both energy and shields drop would IMHO be too much.... one or the other however would be about perfect. Either you are more vulnerable because you have no shields and have to sacrifice energy to recharge faster or you can't fire your main guns because your energy is at 0 (and you have to wait till you can recloak)... having 0 energy and 0 shields.... well... That would make the cloaking device basically an emergency escape from battle only type of device (since you wouldn't be able to fire anything but missiles, or recloak, or shoot your main guns). While this wouldn't be the end of the world I think it wouldn't make PvP battles any more fun and it might make them more frustrating... (I just like the suspense of knowing there is an enemy cloaked somewhere nearby that will attack soon

) Making the cloak more into an escape tool would just make battles more frustrating

, not more suspensefull. (and I like the suspense!

)

I voted for energy based on the fact that if you have full energy you could still decloak... fire misiles... and then recloak... Keeping the current need for high energy to start the cloak and making the energy at 0 when you decloak would keep this from happeneing... Then again, if thier shields were at 0 they would be vulnerable to a quick counterattack (if you could get a missile lock before they recloaked that is).

If changing the cloaking device is seen overall by everyone as a bad thing perhaps there could be a tacheon detector that would allow you to see a ghost of the ship but not acquire missile lock on it? This would be another equipment option that would force people to choose what they carry and don't carry... (as of right now I normally fly with an empty equipment slot because there really isn't a need for anything other than jump drive, cannon relay, shield boost, repair sys) I'm all about making there be too many choices to have them all and having to balance what you take with you. I think the ship building in ER is a good example that the equipment slots/avail equipment should reflect as well.

That just my 2 cents...

[Edit]

Sorry Vice... I just read the other F7 thread and realized I was the primary reason it went off topic...

My bad...

[Edited on 9-8-2008 by Chikara]

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:15 am

...another vote for #4...

Wolfox · Post by **Wolfox** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:03 am

#4 for me as well. Can't argue with the classics.

49rTbird · Post by **49rTbird** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:13 am

#4 or #5 both sound good but I can't vote for both (lol).

shewter · Post by **shewter** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:21 am

Voted for #4 makes sense for the shields to recharge aft coming out of cloak

Hopsalot · Post by **Hopsalot** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:38 am

I agree with the classic definition logic of choice 4. (I think most of us were introduced to the cloak by the Klingons and Romulans). I also like Chikara's idea about a tachyon detector. (Perhaps hidden in an asteroid, or with some new clues.)

CS-ACI- · Post by **CS-ACI-** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 5:44 am

Hello,

I voted for number 5, the cloak should have a heavy penalty for its use.

Steve

warsign · Post by **warsign** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 6:45 am

#4 is good to me.Versions of the cloak device can sell in the trading station.Traditional one and others...

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:34 am

Detection equipment....

now really, what good is a doggone cloaking device if other pilots can still detect you...?

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:58 am

I would also like to see some kind of detection. I was thinking it should be tied to the "Science Officer" and the scanner. Not that you would actually "see" the cloaked ship, just a shimmer if possible. Barring that, some kind of warning that a cloaked ship is nearby.

Chikara · Post by **Chikara** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 9:05 am

aye... possibly a sound notification from the science offcer saying unusual levels of tacheon radiation in the area or something... that would work.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 9:37 am

Originally posted by MMaggio
I would also like to see some kind of detection. I was thinking it should be tied to the "Science Officer" and the scanner. Not that you would actually "see" the cloaked ship, just a shimmer if possible. Barring that, some kind of warning that a cloaked ship is nearby.

Why?

d_k_k_y · Post by **d_k_k_y** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 10:02 am

Because if a cloaked ship reapears right behind you it can easely take you out with full weapon power - even if it has low shilds...

If you know that there is a cloaked ship around you could prepare a little better.

I would like to see nebula clouds or other invironments which neutralize the cloaking effect (maybe just MDTS keeps working abnormal there but you can see the ship). This would enrich the taktical use of these environments!

[Edited on 8-9-2008 by d_k_k_y]

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 10:19 am

Originally posted by d_k_k_y

I would like to see nebula clouds or other invironments which neutralize the cloaking effect (maybe just MDTS keeps working abnormal there but you can see the ship). This would enrich the taktical use of these environments!

[Edited on 8-9-2008 by d_k_k_y]

... another good idea...
[I gather we have all seen the movie?]

KlingonEmpire · Post by **KlingonEmpire** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 10:41 am

Jeremy is correct. No cloak detection please.

d_k_k_y · Post by **d_k_k_y** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 11:22 am

I would also add to the discussion that an unlimited cloaking might reduce the fun in MP a lot. Even with the current system some players (e.g. Kahless) are more often invisible than present. If now players can simply use a device as much and long as they want, the battlefield will become a lonely place.

Kills will get much harder because players simply hide before they loose the fight - not once or twice with high costs - but as often and long as they want....

Many player will fly stealthed by default, just to evade that other stealthed players suddenly attack them. -> Less live in MP.

The more I think about the idea I don't like it. We had this discussion long ago and the result was the current setup - keep at it imho. Cloaking should add tactical elements and not the ability to elude the game and its players.

If there comes an unlimited cloaking device there have to be other devices as well which represent an effective setoff imho. Keep also in mind that a combination of stealth and excalibur would be possibel if an unlimited cloaking device would be added (8 free hardpoints!!!)!

[Edited on 8-9-2008 by d_k_k_y]

verbosity · Post by **verbosity** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 11:32 am

Originally posted by d_k_k_y
I would also add to the discussion that an unlimited cloaking might reduce the fun in MP a lot. Even with the current system some players (e.g. Kahless) are more often invisible than present. If now players can simply use a device as much and long as they want, the battlefield will become a lonely place.
[Edited on 8-9-2008 by d_k_k_y]

I agree with that, if a cloaking device were to be reusable it should have limitations, firstly a recharge time of at least 1minute plus, secondly multiple slots though 8 would be too much imho. I'd suggest 6.

its also quite hard to cloak in the middle of a battle anyway, since you need full energy to cloak, so I'd want to see that kept, as well as removing the shield when cloaked ( making it that much harder to cloak in combat due to the risk of being hit by a stray shot.

I also love the idea of having some nebula clouds that reduce the effectiveness of cloaking, I'd also love to see cloaked ships not just dissappear but have some sort of visual shimmer, kind of like the predator, in the film of the same name.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 12:45 pm

There's already a stealth device in the game and most people do not use it.

I think your worries about all the players in MP flying around stealthed to avoid getting attacked are a bit far-fetched, Dan.

Many of the encounters in MP involve multiple ships. Even if you do unstealth and smash your target apart with an Excalibur, if your shields and energy are drained(option number five), you'll be an easy target for your target's pals.

It would be rather impossible to stealth if you're about to die due to the rather high possiblity that your energy levels will be low and your shield levels will be low(as with my suggestion you'd need arrays and energy at full levels to cloak)

As for a detector, Vice has said that if you keep an eye on your environment you can detect a cloaked ship as it is(I assume by the way they disrupt viewing objects on the other side of them).

Also, Verb, not sure what you mean about slots, but Vice said this would be a piece of equipment, not something taking up hardpoints...

BraveHart · Post by **BraveHart** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:08 pm

The New Cloaking device has a lot of good potential out side of combat: As a New Pilot you could explore with out the fear of being blown away by a Hostile....at least until you get more combat experience, but there are some pilots who don't like to fight and enjoy mining and trading thus cloaking will be a plus for them, Also if the new pilot inadvertently pops in on a "Clan Battle" they could seek relative safety behind a cloak and observe or leave. The Nebula cloud ideal sounds great and would add to combat tactics against those who favor a cloaked ship. MP is gaining in popularity and is growing in numbers, but I think it would be a great addition for the whole of Evochron Renegade players everywhere. #4 sounds great and seems to be the right choice for me

KlingonKringle · Post by **KlingonKringle** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:15 pm

I vote for number 4, my only concern is the length of time it would take to powerup shield after de-cloak. If it takes too long the device is useless as an offensive item.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:24 pm

Well, I hope so. If you're wanting to use stealth for offenses, the current Stealth Device is the proper tool.

Fearless · Post by **Fearless** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:38 pm

Definitely no. 4 4 me but what would I have to give up seeing I only have 5 equipment bays.

[Edited on 9-8-2008 by Fearless]