2 ideas for Vice to consider

[tha_rami]

An EMP Torpedo. That could be interesting too. I just like the idea of a field instead of 'yet another missile'. Everyone uses Leech, Exodus or Excalibur anyway.

[Vice]

I have a question Vice. When this new missile hits, will you surprise us with graphics that show some kind of energy field enveloping the target, wraping around the engine naceles?

No, but that sounds like a cool effect for an EMP, if it's something I can work in.

Similar to the probe idea suggested before, but a little different. Something like a torpedo that fires at a set range and effects a specific area. I'd say a radius of 4 to 5 k from the point of detonation and lasting for maybe 30 seconds. This way there wouldn't be a probe or ship to destory, but you could fly outside the field fairly readily. Perhaps the ENG section of your status could flash to show you are in a no-jump field.

No warp zones have a potential to negatively effect new players who are often just trying to survive and make it from A to B, which is why the missile idea to target a specific ship for this effect seems like a better option... rather than new players finding themselves stuck in one of these no warp zones, eliminating their only means of escape since they have no other method to defend themselves. We don't yet have this problem, but it could become a potential issue in the near future as multiplayer use continues to build. Limiting it to a targeting missile that effects individual ships forces some more tactical considerations and strategies. Mass effect weapons that force functional limitations in large areas should be considered carefully, especially since it seems like once they're available, they get used all the time (think FT) and complaints about over-use start to surface.

And with changes like this, I will indeed be most interested in hearing from those of you who use multiplayer and that I've/we've flown with in recent weeks who've been in the same battles, as this is the kind of change/addition that will effect you the most and since we've established the combat situations where the pros and cons of something like this can be appropriately gauged.

[tha_rami]

No warp zones have a potential to negatively effect new players who are often just trying to survive and make it from A to B, which is why the missile idea to target a specific ship for this effect seems like a better option... rather than new players finding themselves stuck in one of these no warp zones, eliminating their only means of escape since they have no other method to defend themselves. We don't yet have this problem, but it could become a potential issue in the near future as multiplayer use continues to build. Limiting it to a targeting missile that effects individual ships forces some more tactical considerations and strategies. Mass effect weapons that force functional limitations in large areas should be considered carefully, especially since it seems like once they're available, they get used all the time (think FT) and complaints about over-use start to surface.

If its a tactical part of gameplay, players will grow accustomed to it. The newer players by definition have the fastest ships, so they are relatively safe from the heavy armament fighters. Also, there is no obvious use for the missiles besides in contracts or clan vs clan wars.

I disagree that a single missile will add tactical considerations. It will just not be used as an Leech does the same thing, more effective and is too expensive to practically use. After all, if you land this missile, you might just as well have landed an Exodus to take out the target.

On top, by 2300, the technology to have area of effect weapons should probably be advanced enough to allow mercenaries to use some basic ones. We all know the torpedo is military property and thus expensive, but it would add a lot if Pirates could actually use weapons to disable your craft.

Mass Effect weapons should be limited. I feel that either they should take more slots (ie torpedo = 3 slots) or they should be expensive. I dislike the current torpedo for its prize vs effect ratio, and on the other hand I feel you can load too many.

A similar no-jump field would be cheaper than a torpedo, as it doesn't kill anyone. Contracts involving them should offer enough revenue to pay for the missile or even deliver it. The warning that sounds when a torpedo is launched could count here as well.

I really vote for a mass effect disruption weapon. A gravity weapon would be fun too.

[Edited on 17-8-2008 by tha_rami]

[Vice]

If its a tactical part of gameplay, players will grow accustomed to it.

That's the same kind of argument used to justify allowing weapons to be swapped in space, so I probably won't be adding add such a thing based on that kind of point for obvious reasons

I disagree that a single missile will add tactical considerations. It will just not be used as an Leech does the same thing, more effective and is too expensive to practically use. After all, if you land this missile, you might just as well have landed an Exodus to take out the target.

Let me provide a specific example of tactical use then to illustrate what I mean by the difference between a ship-specific missile and a mass effect device. If it's a missile, you could cloak to sneak up on a ship, decloak quickly, then attack at point blank range in an attempt to increase your chances for a successful hit. It's a three step tactical approach. With a mass effect device with wide range, all you have to do is plant it and wait for the effect, not much tactical/strategic use required.

One way a wide range device might be practical is if the user has to sacrifice something as well in order to activate it, say something like all of their systems temporarily shut down while the device is active (like a 'death blossom') and it takes a while before their systems come back online. This would require them to use teamwork with other players who will fill the attack role and help protect the player who's engaging the no-warp device. It would add a little more tactical requirement into the mix that would otherwise require nothing more than 'just get in the general area'.

Mass Effect weapons should be limited. I feel that either they should take more slots (ie torpedo = 3 slots) or they should be expensive. I dislike the current torpedo for its prize vs effect ratio, and on the other hand I feel you can load too many.

It's not the loading penalty or the cost I'm concerned about, it's the potential over-use and excessive capabilities. That's where limitations and/or compromises would likely need to be applied. Limiting it to a missile forces ship-specific targeting, practical defensive options, and individual effects rather than wiping out huge sections of space.

[tha_rami]

It's not the loading penalty or the cost I'm concerned about, it's the potential over-use and excessive capabilities. That's where limitations and/or compromises would likely need to be applied. Limiting it to a missile forces ship-specific targeting, practical defensive options, and individual effects rather than wiping out huge sections of space.

But by making it that way, you also wipe out the entire usability of the weapon.

I like having the systems shut down. Heck, I'd even like it if the ship itself emitted the jump scrambler at the cost of having the engines and weapons shut down, like in the original plan.

I'd also like seeing "jump scars", like I once said, that allow you to jump after a ship if you can hit its jump point in time. But that's totally feature creep and totally unrelated, so basically: a mass effect weapon that allows you to take out a battlefields jumping capabilities for a limited time (say two minutes) would be both fun and strategic.

For example, if it were a torpedo, asteroids could be a dangerous field to fight as a single of these anti-jump missiles could change the field into a death trap in seconds. In combination with cloaking (which I'd rather see to be permanent than timed, or have no time deducted when not using afterburner) this could lead to interesting 'trap' situations.

[Edited on 17-8-2008 by tha_rami]

[MMaggio]

I agree with Vice. I think this new weapon is something that would encourage team play, assigning one player to take out the warp and the rest to finish the ship off. Gives "newbies" and smaller ships the opportunity to take out bigger, faster ships, and forces players to engage in real combat flight.
My two cents...

[tha_rami]

In that case, the whole missile barely has any use as an Exodus is far more useful.

[d_k_k_y]

Originally posted by tha_rami
I'd also like seeing "jump scars", like I once said, that allow you to jump after a ship if you can hit its jump point in time.

That would be sweet . Would add some pursuit. And also add the need to jump into or near a nebula could / cave for better cover. Nebula clouds are tactically useless for MP atm.

Poor Vice, so many wishes, things to consider, technical problems to solve.

[Edited on 18-8-2008 by d_k_k_y]

[tha_rami]

Yeah, it's the main reason I suggested the "scars". As far as I'm concerned, they could just look like the blue flash you see when somebody jumps now, and act like a wormhole. They could stay open for 30 seconds, for example.

Basically, it would be placing a wormhole where the jumping ship went with as destination the destination of the jumping ship, then removing it when the scar fades out.

If you have a pretty manoeuvrable ship, you could even trick enemies into crashing into things, or kill yourself to kill 3 more to enlighten your clan during combat.

That is, of course, unless there's a no-jump forcefield at your current location. In that case, you'd have to focus on either getting out or killing the one 'casting' the field. But you could be sure that guy is pretty well defended.

[Edited on 18-8-2008 by tha_rami]

[d_k_k_y]

Ah, ok now I understand your point.
Little WHs would be too much changing the game imho. I would rather see a sign on the Nav map after someone near you jump away (similar to the location sign after starting a contract). This sign might fade out after some secconds. You can right click on it to set the coords.

[gietek]

I have to say I don't like the idea of having super-weapon in general.
Not much fun in wiping all your enemy out at one go, is there? - sneaking around with cloak on, then disable all jump drives/systems and fire a torpedo killing everything in a radius of 10km.

ER is not only about fighting. What about miners or traders who don't want to be involved in battles?
Imagine that you are clearing energy array, no enemy around, sun is gently warming you up ;-) and then suddenly hostile ship appears and kills you within 5 seconds. How annoying.

But it's just my opinion.

[d_k_k_y]

I dislike super weapons as well.
But the ability to follow someone who try to escape / hide somewhere would add much imho.

If we keep at super weapons: How about a super weapon which only works if e.g. at least three ships start it in close time? :P