Strange system reputation drop

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:08 pm

While I finally managed to get Pearl system to 'fair' I suddenly noticed a massive reputation drop to 'hostile' for the whole system. Fortunately I save often and in new profile slots (another unexpected reason to change slots as often as possible) and compared this profile with one that was just 3 minutes older. The latter was fine, reputation still 'fair'. I also thoroughly studied the flight logs from the 'hostile' profile but couldn't find anything that would explain the reputation drop. Unfortunately I deleted that file so I don't have any evidence now for further investigation. To me it smells like a bug cause even if I accidentally would have killed a red Navy here I doubt such a single event would have such a massive impact. I need to add that my 'fair' state is pretty fresh and both Navy and Energy reputations are still pretty low between 50% and 60% (miners are higher).

So now I'm curious: What could have drained my system reputation in such a drastic manner (mind you: from fair to hostile, not to moderate!), any ideas?

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:10 pm

Did you use the same profile for both SP and MP?

Nigel_Strange · Post by **Nigel_Strange** » Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:38 pm

Perhaps someone is circulating rumors about your...proclivities.

Don't look at me. I'm your friend.

I just heard stuff.

If you play multiplayer, don't save your game in MP to the SP profile.

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:55 pm

I've never touched MP so far.
Next try...

[Edited on 26-4-2014 by picommander]

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 12:17 am

Did you accidently do a spy contract for rebels or a delivery contract for a guild?

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 12:31 am

That's the closest idea to what I thought by myself. So 100 points for you and for now Marvin (until I know better).
Sometimes I do have such brainfarts...

PaulB · Post by **PaulB** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 2:09 am

From post: 169299, Topic: tid=11363, author=picommander wrote:While I finally managed to get Pearl system to 'fair' I suddenly noticed a massive reputation drop to 'hostile' for the whole system. Fortunately I save often and in new profile slots (another unexpected reason to change slots as often as possible) and compared this profile with one that was just 3 minutes older. The latter was fine, reputation still 'fair'. I also thoroughly studied the flight logs from the 'hostile' profile but couldn't find anything that would explain the reputation drop. Unfortunately I deleted that file so I don't have any evidence now for further investigation. To me it smells like a bug cause even if I accidentally would have killed a red Navy here I doubt such a single event would have such a massive impact. I need to add that my 'fair' state is pretty fresh and both Navy and Energy reputations are still pretty low between 50% and 60% (miners are higher).

So now I'm curious: What could have drained my system reputation in such a drastic manner (mind you: from fair to hostile, not to moderate!), any ideas?

I would have suggested you email Vice - but he would need the pilot profile to investigate and since you deleted it there's not much he can do at this point - but you might want to let him know anyway - so he's aware there may be an issue.

Paul

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 11:18 am

I'd assume Vice is reading the forum, there are not that much posts anyway. Since I can't deliver any evidence so what could he say? There's only guesswork here. I was hoping something like that has already happened before. Also, I can't exclude for sure an accident of the sort Marvin mentioned above (probably a result of breaking rule Nr.42: Don't drink'n fly).

[Edited on 27-4-2014 by picommander]

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 2:42 pm

From post: 169319, Topic: tid=11363, author=picommander wrote:rule Nr.42: Don't drink'n fly) ....

I believe the actual rule of thumb is: 12 hours between bottle and throttle.

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:00 pm

From post: 169320, Topic: tid=11363, author=Marvin wrote: I believe the actual rule of thumb is: 12 hours between bottle and throttle.

So the bug was probably sitting behind the bottle..

Just out of curiosity: Assuming I actually still had this file, is it possible (maybe for Vice?) to extract specific contract details from it?
As it seems such details, especially for whom I worked, are not visible in the common flight logs.

Meanwhile I think deleting this file was the real blunder.

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:28 pm

Never mind.

[Edited on 4-27-2014 by Marvin]

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:41 pm

Ah you edited your post, mine doesn't make then no sense as well

[Edited on 27-4-2014 by picommander]

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 6:24 pm

Yeah, after posting, I checked the Flight/Event Log again and decided that number I mentioned represents something else. I also did a delivery contract for the bad guys to see how it's registered in the Log. Result: not enough info to determine if I'd done a contract for the good guys or the bad guys.

Post by **DaveK** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 8:31 pm

From post: 169321, Topic: tid=11363, author=picommander wrote:
Just out of curiosity: Assuming I actually still had this file, is it possible (maybe for Vice?) to extract specific contract details from it?
As it seems such details, especially for whom I worked, are not visible in the common flight logs.

Meanwhile I think deleting this file was the real blunder.

As far as I can see we can't do anything with the files but Vice can not only read them he can edit them and 'heal' them. In the past he's bailed pilots outwho have had important profiles corrupted through no fault of their own.

Deleting profiles is an easy mistake to make . . . 'when will I ever need this one again? . . . but with 100 profile slots available I've decided that it's much easier to store a lot 'just in case'

Before I realised that there was more than one screenful of slots I used to be ruthless and have lost several valuable locations as a result

I use slots 75 - 100 for profiles for places I might just want to visit again without hassle or because they contain one of the Eoverse's wonders - (like the server location at 9999 - 9999 - 9999 or Vonarion or the planet with floating trees). Tucked well out of the way, but still there if I want to check something or experiment

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 8:54 pm

My current saving strategy goes like that: Using all 100 profile slots (saving at a new slot whenever it appears feasible), with occasional name changing when something seriously new happened. After the 100 are full I copy them to an external place (my HD while I'm playing on a SSD) and simply overwrite the current once with a new name. Usually I don't need to delete a file, in this case I just wanted to make sure that no bugged file goes into my archives. Anyway, next time I know better.

@Marvin,

Did you by any chance check your system reputation after your mission for the 'bad' guys? Did it also drop for 2 categories, like mine from fair to hostile?

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 9:21 pm

I think drops depend on where you stand with all the factions before taking a contract for a guild or rebels. I only tested one contract and, since it was in a star system where none of the factions were either high or low, the one contact didn't change anything.

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Sun Apr 27, 2014 11:40 pm

I just did a quick test run: Spy contract for Guild.
The surprising result: Not only was there no system reputation shift, there even was no single change in any fraction reputation!
For completeness sake (before and after the contract):

E: 73%
N: 79%
R: 22%
G: 35%
M: 91%

Usually quite normal that a single contract doesn't change anything and I'm under the impression the higher the system reputation the more 'stable' all reputations are. This comes close to an evidence that one single contract for the wrong side hardly likely can trigger a system reputation shift over 2 stages!

PaulB · Post by **PaulB** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:17 am

From post: 169345, Topic: tid=11363, author=picommander wrote:I just did a quick test run: Spy contract for Guild.
The surprising result: Not only was there no system reputation shift, there even was no single change in any fraction reputation!
For completeness sake (before and after the contract):

E: 73%
N: 79%
R: 22%
G: 35%
M: 91%

Usually quite normal that a single contract doesn't change anything and I'm under the impression the higher the system reputation the more 'stable' all reputations are. This comes close to an evidence that one single contract for the wrong side hardly likely can trigger a system reputation shift over 2 stages!

I just had an email discussion with Vice about a chnage in Nave from like 69% to 72% (after a 2 waypoint contract) down to 71% after a 1 waypoint contract (both using wingmen).

I still don't know what happened but I'm guessing (and Vice said it could happen) that with the combat going on or after the 2nd one was completed (and I killed a Red that was still in the area) that one of the Red "could" have been a Navy Red.
This, btw, is in Olympus. And he said if I or one of my wingmen (who got killed very easily themselves) did kill a Navy Red who happened to be in the area of the Contract that it could be the reason of my Navy dropping to 71% instead of increasing above the prior 72%.

I'm not all that observant in combat and I'm just trying to find the closest Red and forget to look at the affiliation.
I still can't comprehend that Red Navy & Energy would take sides with Red Rebels and Guild.

And I'm amazed how easily my wingmen got killed, especially when I chose ones that were flying Guardians and Legacys rather than the lighter weight civvie frames.
I figured if I could get through 52+ kills without getting killed myself that they should do better than getting killed during the 1st Contract I take on with them. Oh well.

Paul

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 5:37 am

So far I've used a wingman only once, just out of curiosity. The poor guy didn't last long: He was killed by my own excalibur missiles (at this times I wasn't aware that if your enemy is down before all 8 excals are used up the rest would go to the next target, no matter if friend or foe

). This can of course also happen with other allies, so better be careful with excals if allies are near by.

PaulB · Post by **PaulB** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:10 am

From post: 169354, Topic: tid=11363, author=picommander wrote:So far I've used a wingman only once, just out of curiosity. The poor guy didn't last long: He was killed by my own excalibur missiles (at this times I wasn't aware that if your enemy is down before all 8 excals are used up the rest would go to the next target, no matter if friend or foe ). This can of course also happen with other allies, so better be careful with excals if allies are near by.

Really?? That make them useless as far as I'm concerned.

That's what I love about Privateer Gemini Gold.
The Friend or Foe missiles only go after the target they (you) lock them on and are very reiliable.
Image Recognition missiles one step down recognize enemy ship types but can lock on a friendly if he's flying a "enemy" type ship.
Heat Seeking I never used for the simple reason they go after a heat source so can kill enemy and friends alike if in the same area.
I loved the Friend or Foes because as long as you were within range the enemy couldn't avoid them so all they had to depend on was their shield power and Rebels and Pirates generally only took one hit to kill them. Kilrathi tooks a couple of hits.

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:11 pm

Useless? Not at all! I love this really cheap killing machine and I also love the challenge of the responsibility for the when and where to fire them. In games I like friendly fire in general.

But in a way you are right: There are places where I almost entirely refrain from using Excalibur missiles. But you can always put them into your cargo bay and swap some Exodus in. Most of the time I'm just too stingy for that.

Post by **Marvin** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:16 pm

I still can't comprehend that Red Navy & Energy would take sides with Red Rebels and Guild.

They don't. Federation naval and energy pilots might not like you (as an Alliance mercenary) but that by no means implies that they do like rebel or guild pilots. Theirs' is not a situation where the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Post by **Vice** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 5:28 pm

Useless? Not at all! I love this really cheap killing machine and I also love the challenge of the responsibility for the when and where to fire them.

Yes, that's exactly what they are designed to do, require careful application for a given situation. They are a weapon that carries risk and should generally only be used in scenarios against multiple hostile targets as a fighter suppression weapon.

This game provides a unique tactical element with missiles, namely the ability to control them in flight. With the additional capability and control comes some additional responsibility and risk, particularly with certain weapons.

In many games, if you fire a missile, your decision has been made, your control is over, and you're done in terms of directing the weapon fire. If your target is destroyed before your missile reaches it, the missile itself is done and it effectively becomes useless. It will then usually either explode immediately or fly around aimlessly for a while and explode later.

In this game, the missile is still live and still under your control. It remains linked to your targeting computer and you can direct it to a new target while still in flight. Your targeting computer will default to the next nearest hostile in the area automatically. But you need to remain aware of what you are tracking to avoid friendly fire scenarios. Missiles in general are often best suited to multiple hostile situations, so their damage can be maximized and risk minimized. If you get caught in a situation where a missile is tracking a ship you don't want it to track, then you may need to cycle through targets to avoid hitting anything until it explodes. Target one at far range to give the missile time to self-detonate before it impacts anything.

In general, if you're fighting only one hostile, you really shouldn't be using (wasting) a missile anyway, especially not an excalibur. You should be sticking with beam and particle cannons to attack with. Although if you have a low cost missile, it can come in handy to finish off a single target.

Rubber Chicken · Post by **Rubber Chicken** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:10 pm

One fun thing to try is gunning multiple red targets down to around 5% hull, then seeing how many you can finish off with a single Excalibur launch.

My current record is 3.

picommander · Post by **picommander** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:04 pm

How do you call this sport, rat bowling?

Thanks Vice, learned something new (again) here.