Spoiler Alert

shoggothfodder · Post by **shoggothfodder** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 3:41 am

Okay so I've been mining pretty faithfully in olympus and I've managed to upgrade my ship to where it's at least halfway decent. I got a little bored and decided to maybe do a little of the trading. I looked up the economy of the systems and figured that if I bought some equipment in saphire I could sell it somewhere in Olympus for a profit. Not so much.

Question #1: Why did I lose money? I just bought a bunch of random shield boosters and stuff, but sold it for a loss at olympus.

So after that I figured to hell with it and set off for (I think it's called) Onyx for the first time. Turns out they freaking hate me for some reason. They wouldn't let me on the station and I was getting attacked from 5 sides.

Questions #2 and 3: What the hell did I do to them and how do I fix it without having to pay the enormous licence fee?

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 7:08 am

You should've kept going. Cerulean sells really cheap. And its neighbor (a very safe system), Atlas, pays top dollar. Trade big- ticket items for the most profit. But steer clear of Hostile systems ... you can tell which are hostile because the right side of the Navigation Console has it posted in big red letters.

Edit: ... Btw, I did a Search for the word "rep" and came up with a lot of good info ... and this:

Compare that with the standard quadrant map. You might notice that Onyx is a Moderate system. Not quite as bad as a Hostile system ... but ... well, read some of the stuff posted under "rep" to get an idea as to why you get the kind of greeting you get from various star systems.

[Edited on 9-8-2012 by Marvin]

[Edited on 2-2-2013 by Marvin]

shoggothfodder · Post by **shoggothfodder** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 4:26 pm

Thanks! The rep system is the only thing I really don't like about this game. It just seems tacked on and silly. It would make a bit more sense if it was called clan or racial relations, but the idea that an entire systems hates me personally seems artificial to me. Thanks again for your answer, looks like I gotta strike out further...

Off topic this is an excellent forum. Maybe because the community is relatively small but man, you guys are really nice.

Post by **Vice** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 6:40 pm

From post: 144739, Topic: tid=9779, author=shoggothfodder wrote:Thanks! The rep system is the only thing I really don't like about this game. It just seems tacked on and silly. It would make a bit more sense if it was called clan or racial relations, but the idea that an entire systems hates me personally seems artificial to me. Thanks again for your answer, looks like I gotta strike out further...

The rep system may take some getting used to, especially if you're familiar with or expect a different kind of system to be in place. However, there are some reasons behind it that I'll try to explain below and it is functionally a 'clan relation' based system. Some of these are excerpts from previous discussions about it:

In terms of 'hates you personally', it isn't that they hate you per se, but that you start out allied with factions that are against them and their interests (either because of past conflicts with those factions or simply because you are viewed as a trespasser). For example, if you were affiliated with the US Navy in 1944, why would the Japanese Navy attack you, but the US Navy not? It's the same reason(s) many Richton and Federation territories (and their Navies) will attack you, but Alliance/Sapphire's won't. If you are from an opposing territory (or allied with it), you will be attacked by the enemy of that territory. By default, you are from Sapphire, an Alliance territory and your reputations start out as allied to that group. This automatically makes you the enemy of forces that oppose the Alliance.

Without hostile forces in place, the risk factor of the game would be much lower, reducing the challenge and hence, reducing the potential risk-to-reward factor. With that said however, there are ways you can avoid dealing with the reputation system in several ways. You have the option of not engaging those hostile forces if you don't want to. It's your choice if you want to engage them, but there are plenty of defensive options available to you to avoid combat if you just want to trade and explore... even in hostile space. Those options involve proper jump drive management, inertial high speed travel, cloaking devices, baiting, and bribing. You can do a lot of trade and exploration without ever having to fire a shot, but it does require a different set of tactics.

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 7:44 pm

Personally, I think the current real world order of hostility is rather silly and artificial. I'd rather live in the Evoverse.

shoggothfodder · Post by **shoggothfodder** » Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:19 pm

Hrm...I should explain myself...

I don't so much mind the rep system being there, as much as I mind the way it is presented (to new players, at least).

I personally have not attacked anyone that didn't attack me first, AND I didn't choose any kind of alien race or political view or anything like that, so it seems that I am being attacked by people I can't really identify, for reasons unknown to me.

I love the combat and I want more of it, but I'd like to know WHY I'm having to blow up these people, or why they won't let me in their station.

If they were pirates or just all-around bad people that would make sense, but by calling it "rep" it makes me think that it is something that is affected by my actions, which I know it is eventually, but not at the beginning.

I guess I just wanted to start neutral, or at least be given a choice in the beginning who hates me and who doesn't.

Really it's just me nit-picking though. I'm having a helluva time with this game, and I know I haven't even scratched the surface of what I can do yet. I can definitely deal with the rep system as I slowly learn which systems are which. I really wish I could go MP with you guys, but with my connection speed I would lag the universe to a stand-still at this point, and with two kids approaching college age high speed internet just isn't a huge priority right now.

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Sep 09, 2012 12:12 am

From post: 144760, Topic: tid=9779, author=shoggothfodder wrote:... AND I didn't choose any kind of alien race or political view or anything like that ....

As Vice explained (and has been said many places elsewhere in this forum), yes you did. You (like all the rest of us) are, by default, part of the Alliance. Consequently, you (like the rest of us) do not start out on good terms with anybody not aligned with the Alliance.

In SP, you can remedy that by homesteading in an otherwise unfriendly star system and helping out. And the key word here is "homesteading."

shoggothfodder · Post by **shoggothfodder** » Sun Sep 09, 2012 12:53 am

Okay...I'm starting to see the big picture on rep now...I think.

Thanks for your patience with me.

A few things I *think* I have learned, please correct me if I am wrong:
1. Money is NOT the main point of doing trade station missions. The main point is generally to increase your rep with a certain faction.
2. Paying the fees and toughing it out in a hostile (ish) system and doing repeated missions and things will slowly increase your rep with that faction, and you will be attacked less and less over time in that system, and systems of that faction.
3. Increasing the rep with one faction will invariably lower the rep with another faction.
4. Which factions to ally with is a decision that needs to be made rather early in the game.

I guess that's it...the rep system is the only thing really confusing me right now. I'm currently mining and upgrading in Cerulean until I feel comfortable enough to start working on the quest again.

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Sep 09, 2012 2:30 am

Almost. There's the global (star system ... overall) reputation and the reputation with each faction. Rebels and Guild have a bad reputation in just about every system ... you don't want to be doing favors for them if you can help it. Better to do favors for anyone else. But it won't do you much good in multiplayer ... you can't turn an entire system to your favor in MP 'cause you're not the only real life mercenary wandering from star to planet.

Things are much different in single-player. Assuming you pick a star system and stick with it until you've increased your reputation. If you move on too soon, the bad guys will return and beat up on the poor, defenseless folk you abandoned. Not a good outcome.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:01 pm

Also when you are born in this world you do not have a choice either of who your enemies and friends are, it all depends in which country or on what planet you are born!...

:P

hank · Post by **hank** » Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:57 pm

Thanks to all. I've learned a lot from this thread.

I had $$'s in my eyes and was mining like crazy and taking on just a few contracts. I can make more money mining than most contracts pay. I have not paid much attention to my reputation. ... so far

I will now.

have a nice day

Post by **Marvin** » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:31 am

Payment received for completing contracts increases as your civilian reputation increases. When doing them co-op in MP, always let the high-ranking pilot take the contracts.

Post by **DaveK** » Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:16 pm

Although it contains spoilers, if you go to SeeJay's website

http://evochron.junholt.se/menus/downloads.htm

you can download a Hints&Tips&Tutorials Guide. It contains a section explaining the whole reputation system.

Be careful though because it does have hundreds of things that can be spoilers!

hank · Post by **hank** » Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:51 pm

I'm still figuring out rep and have a couple of observation / questions.

I'm sure this obvious question is answered on this forum or in the guide books but .... question 1: a pilot is not part of a faction at first (afaik) ... he/she has to earn the reputation for a faction to be friends. Is that a correct observation?

The only way tell what faction you are in good graces with is in the News Console where those pilots you can consider friends have the higher "good" rating. Is that correct?

A territorial ?: I've been spending a lot of time in Rucker and flying through Pearl to the hidden planet for trading. It appears there is a hard line between those two systems and being moderatley reputable in both is not possible. Is that right? (I would like to dock at Port Oasis but the reds are so thick I can't)

As the OP mentioned; if I was able to improve my rep in Pearl, my rep in Rucker would drop ... and somewhere in the middle every ship I pass by would be yellow and red ... no friendlies because I'm half way reputable in both.

I noticed while flying in Rucker I'll see some Navy ships yellow and some green friendly. Why some are green and others not? And of course when I go to Pearl they are nearly all red.

And one last question that has nothing to do with Rep. I read in a completely different site, the planets are all the same size. Is that right? I have not been able to tell or the time to investigate since I just read that recently.

mostly observations above looking for affirmation
thanks ... and what a wonderful sim this is

[Edited on 9-29-2012 by hank]

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Sep 29, 2012 4:25 pm

In Mercenary, the planets are not all the same size (somebody must've been thinking of Legends). In the expansion, sizes vary even more.

hank · Post by **hank** » Sat Sep 29, 2012 7:11 pm

Thanks ... I did not think so but I couldn't be sure. I had not tried to judge sizes. You're right it could have been a Post about Legends.

I sneaked into Capella and looked at a big ringed planet I'm guessing was a gas giant. It looked big but I had just evaded a couple of reds, was low on missiles and was skooting out of there as fast as possible.

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Sep 29, 2012 8:21 pm

Gas giants are easy to recognize. They are banded and look a bit like Jupiter.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:50 pm

From post: 145676, Topic: tid=9779, author=hank wrote:I'm still figuring out rep and have a couple of observation / questions.

I'm sure this obvious question is answered on this forum or in the guide books but .... question 1: a pilot is not part of a faction at first (afaik) ... he/she has to earn the reputation for a faction to be friends. Is that a correct observation?

The only way tell what faction you are in good graces with is in the News Console where those pilots you can consider friends have the higher "good" rating. Is that correct?

A territorial ?: I've been spending a lot of time in Rucker and flying through Pearl to the hidden planet for trading. It appears there is a hard line between those two systems and being moderatley reputable in both is not possible. Is that right? (I would like to dock at Port Oasis but the reds are so thick I can't)

As the OP mentioned; if I was able to improve my rep in Pearl, my rep in Rucker would drop ... and somewhere in the middle every ship I pass by would be yellow and red ... no friendlies because I'm half way reputable in both.

I noticed while flying in Rucker I'll see some Navy ships yellow and some green friendly. Why some are green and others not? And of course when I go to Pearl they are nearly all red.

And one last question that has nothing to do with Rep. I read in a completely different site, the planets are all the same size. Is that right? I have not been able to tell or the time to investigate since I just read that recently.

mostly observations above looking for affirmation
thanks ... and what a wonderful sim this is

[Edited on 9-29-2012 by hank]

You are not a part of any faction. You are a Mercenary working for your self or a Clan if you have joined one.

You can improve your reputation in a System by doing contracts for the Navy, Energy and Miners and killing all the Guilds and Rebbels. If you do Contracts for the Guilds and Rebbels the Guild and Rebbels will become friendly to you but your System reputation will stay Hostile, since the ruling parties in every System in Mercenary are the Navy, Energy and Miners!

So a Good rating that you read in the news console in a particular System tells you that you are on good terms with the Navy, Energy and Miners and all Rebbels and Guilds are the friendly ones that follow the Rules of the rulling parties. You can kill as many Rebbels and Guilds as you like even the Green and Yellow ones and your reputation in the System will stay Good.

You should be able to work your way up to a Good Reputation in both Rucker and Pearl by doing contracts for the rulling parties in those System and killing all the hostile Rebbels and Guilds in those system. I have a Good Reputation in all known Systems and most unknown Systems.....

hank · Post by **hank** » Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:27 pm

w/o muddling up the Clan forum I'm going to ask this question here. I read a few pages down in that forum and did not see an answer to my curiosity.

I've never been part of a clan in any game. In the ancient game Mechwarrior there were clans but I was never a member of any clans even though I played on line for years until carpal tunnel took over.

What is/are the benefits to being in a clan?

Is it comaraderie? Team combat against other clans? or other Benefits beyond the wildest imagination? ... just curious since I've never been in a clan

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:34 pm

It is all of the above!.....You can start your own Clan, Declare war on other Clans or form treaties, or have competitions, some clans pay you to join and offer free Tacos!....

:P

Post by **Marvin** » Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:14 am

Nex time you're on line, go into the Navigation Console (default F1) and click on the "Quadrant" button. Each one of the tags you see (IIRC, only those over 80%) pay out more than 100,000 credits, per cycle, to each member of the corresponding clan.

hank · Post by **hank** » Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:15 pm

Thanks to all.

I did that and saw the red overlays with the Clan sign. Interesting. I'm not that good to join a clan yet. But I did reach Skilled level a short while ago ... now I have three buttons.

But as usual I have another question / observation.

I have a stealth generator and have used it effectively several times. A great thing to have on board.

But a few days ago I bought a Shield Recharger (to go with the Shield Booster) ... thinking it would help my shields. I don't know if it did or not BUT, I noticed my Stealth Generator would crap out as soon as I hit "I" ... it would start at +-60% and immediately drop to around 19% and go away soon after.

I could not figure out what was happening so I unloaded the Shield Generator (actually in the tech manual its Shield Array Recharger) after reading up on it and my Stealth Generator came back to life.

So the question is after all this rambling: Is a Shield Array Recharger of any use on a ship? Or is it only for stations? The tech manual doesn't really make it clear.

thanks in advance

49rTbird · Post by **49rTbird** » Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:33 pm

Shield recharger and Stealth generator both use lots of energy. It may end up being your choice as to which you want at what time.

hank · Post by **hank** » Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:01 pm

thanks many times over

So it sounds like the Shield Array Recharger does help with shield integrity on civ ships. I just have not noticed (probably cause I'm in panic mode when its doing its job).

I have not died too many times lately but I have been pounded a few times and thought I was a goner ... then escape and live to tell about it.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:13 pm

Shield recharger drains a lot of energy from your equipment to prioritize shield integrity. You will notice with a shield recharger your energy to weapons gets depleted very quickly when you get hit by enemy fire and you have no ability to fire but your shields will hold much longer with than without the shield recharger! So your Stealth generators energy will also drain very quickly when you have a shield recharger. The Shields get energy priority with a shield recharger!....