Excalibur Pack

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:33 am

Hello all, I was thinking about a change to this missile system to make it more effective in some way.

As it stands now if players choose to use this it's the only type of missiles they can carry.
What is usually also the case is that you waste about half the missiles unless you switch targets after the first target is blown to space debris.

What I was thinking is make the Excalibur Pack smaller, 4 slots with 4 missiles, same 3 minute reload to prevent it to become overpowered.
This way you can either choose to carry 2 Excalibur Packs or you can use the other 4 slots for other devices. (Stealth Field, shut down missiles or a Fulcrum Torpedo as backup if things get out of hand.

We could also keep the Excalibur Pack and add an Excalibur Pack lite version with the 4 slot 4 missile option.

What do you guys think or do you have additional idea's about this?

[Edited on 3-17-2011 by Nubarus]

SeeJay · Post by **SeeJay** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:53 am

I think it's a brilliant idea mate.

Twysted · Post by **Twysted** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:32 am

Also, I was wondering how you can use missile slot 4 instead of using missile slot 1-3 first.

SeeJay · Post by **SeeJay** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:39 am

There is 2 buttons set to step prev and next weapon. Check the keymap in your default game folder.
I have a swedish keyboard, so that will probably not help you.

Dave S · Post by **Dave S** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:06 am

From post: 103791, Topic: tid=7372, author=Nubarus wrote:What I was thinking is make the Excalibur Pack smaller, 4 slots with 4 missiles, same 3 minute reload to prevent it to become overpowered.
This way you can either choose to carry 2 Excalibur Packs or you can use the other 4 slots for other devices. (Stealth Field, shut down missiles or a Fulcrum Torpedo as backup if things get out of hand.

We could also keep the Excalibur Pack and add an Excalibur Pack lite version with the 4 slot 4 missile option.

That would be really cool, though I suspect is there is a 4-slot "Excalibur Pack Lite", then nobody would use the 8-slot version. I like the idea of just making it a 4-slot weapon to increase its utility.

DennyMala · Post by **DennyMala** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:22 am

That should not unbalance too much the game too.

Let's hear what Vice has to say about it, but I think it can be a good improvement.

Moving forward on this, you can allow a user to set the amount of missiles to fire in each salvo so that you can even fire one at time but the pack won't regenerate until it's fully empty.

This way with a single modification you can suit all needs and add flexibility.

Let's say that salvo quantity can't be set on the fly but that will have to be set by manual operation when docked. (probably all will go for a one missile at time unless blocked to a minimum possibile salvo of 2 for instance, but it will allow flexibility)

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:29 am

I too like the idea of an "Excalibur Lite" package. I am ok with a 4 missile salvo. When up against Vonari, 4 might not do the job, but I do like the idea of being able to carry something extra.

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:24 pm

The reasons for exploring this change are mostly the lack of versatility and the waste of missiles since most of the time the extra missiles after you kill the target just dance around the next default target in circles and you only score a few lucky hits if they hit at all.

The missiles are nice, I like their speed and being able to reload em on the fly and not having to travel halfway around the galaxy to restock the missile type you prefer to use but being able to add more utility purpose to the missile system as a whole would be great for certain situations.

It may even give a boost for PvP gameplay, although from what I seen so far the PvP aspect as in actual players vs players battles and not just duels is rather lacking due to the fact that no effort is being put into setting some ground rules for clan war by the clan community.
It's pretty obvious by now that the "attack whenever I am online, even though the enemy is not online so I will solo run contracts all day/night and blow up stations without any form of defense due to timezone and/or work, kids, wife and other hobby's" is clearly not working.

Post by **Marvin** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 5:00 pm

From post: 103801, Topic: tid=7372, author=Nubarus wrote:It may even give a boost for PvP gameplay, although from what I seen so far the PvP aspect as in actual players vs players battles and not just duels is rather lacking due to the fact that no effort is being put into setting some ground rules for clan war by the clan community.

From personal experience, I gotta say, "Watch out for ground rules!" They can make for bad blood.

MiaZ · Post by **MiaZ** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 5:14 pm

From post: 103801, Topic: tid=7372, author=Nubarus wrote:
It may even give a boost for PvP gameplay, although from what I seen so far the PvP aspect as in actual players vs players battles and not just duels is rather lacking due to the fact that no effort is being put into setting some ground rules for clan war by the clan community.

Though I am not sure what kind of rules you might be thinking about, I am open to suggestions.

From post: 103801, Topic: tid=7372, author=Nubarus wrote: It's pretty obvious by now that the "attack whenever I am online, even though the enemy is not online so I will solo run contracts all day/night and blow up stations without any form of defense due to timezone and/or work, kids, wife and other hobby's" is clearly not working

Well, I don't see any other way as things are. Because like you said, due to timezones and/ work, wife, real life stuff we cant all be online at the same time.
Though here too I am open to suggestions.
If a Clan posts in the forum that they would like to get together at a specific time for battle. I would go out of my way to see if I am able to be online, even though it might be very late or early for me in my timezone.

It may not be so easy for others though as I have lots of free time.

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 7:17 pm

I think for now it's too late since both clans have lost too many members to arrange actual battles.

I will leave it among yourselves to see how you will proceed, call a truth, rebuild your clan base and try again maybe?
So far the "war" didn't add anything to the game at all, it only set bad blood among several members who left Remula One.

I am willing to try and help constructing some sort of clan war system once the clans are at combat strength again.

But back on topic.

So far people are positive to the Excalibur Lite Pack.
4 missiles fired, same 3 minute reload and take up 4 missile slots.
The question is, is the game code able to handle this, either 1 Excalibur Lite Pack + additional single shot missiles or a dual Excalibur Lite Pack setup?

Post by **DaveK** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 7:32 pm

How's about being able to set the full Excalibur pack to 2 missiles or 4 missiles or all 8 in one go (a bit like an machine gun's single shot, three round burst and full fire modes)

That way you could get one, two or three shots before the reload! Pehaps reloads after firing or reloads after emptying the pack - either

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 7:58 pm

Then you still loose the versatility and the overall purpose of the request.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:56 pm

I am for the 4 pack Excalibur. Great Idea as long as you have the option to cycle the 4 pack to the bottom slots on the fly just like you can cycle any other missile slot....This is a Great Idea! I like it....Maybe make it more versatile by having Excalibur class 1
missile pack with 4 missiles and a Class 2 with 8 Missiles......

Post by **DaveK** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:14 pm

or class 3 with selectable 2, 4 or 8 per pop!

for me that would be more than versatile enough!

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:14 pm

Now that I think about it, it also opens more options for Civilian frames, especially Explorers, they like to have more crew on board for spotting planets and such and can reduce the missile slots to add more crew and CM packs and still are able to bring a self reloading lite pack for self defense.

Really handy since there are not really that many missile shops in deep space.

Galaxian · Post by **Galaxian** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:40 pm

Excal 4 pack... great idea! I'm all for it.

Nigel_Strange · Post by **Nigel_Strange** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:05 pm

The pack has always filled "eight slots" but you can't actually see the eight slots: only one slot appears to be filled.

Suppose, when you buy the Excal pack, it actually does fill all eight hardpoint slots. When you fire, you fire each missile independently, and then the missile is replaced after the obligatory penalty (I mean refractory) period.

Against vonari, you will probably fire all eight at the same target, but against light frames, probably one or two will do.

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 12:45 am

I carry both as well, for a combat pilot a deploy constructor is very very handy though, especially if you either get banged pretty badly or when 1 pesky little contract foe get's "lost".

Ophiuchus · Post by **Ophiuchus** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:42 am

On the Excalibur Pk recharge times, vice the suggestion for excal lite:
Is there any interest in seeing these recharge times shortened, closer to the time accustomned in Legends ? Or is this barking up the wrong tree ? Happen to like the excal pack. Use it as artillery. Then go in a bust up the large chunks with cannon and laser. Seems to work well enough for me. Faster recharge time for excals would come in handy. Maybe recharge time reductions could be considered for increasing rank/rep, consistant with game-play efforts. Something for nothing doesn't work well for me. Just a thought.

Ophi

Post by **Marvin** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 6:41 am

With the addional energy and 100-pack CMs available to military ships, shield rechargers and auto CM launchers are now a viable option. Shortening the regen time of Excals would be killing the horse deader. Perhaps what we really need is and increase in rank before being able to acquire the higher tech military ships!

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:27 am

I think if you shorten the recharge it will become overpowered.

If you equip 2 Excal Lite Packs you still have the same weapon as we have now, you can only choose to fire at 1 target or 2 with the same 3 minute recharge, only they are now devided over 2 packs.

Post by **DaveK** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:30 am

I disagree with higher rank having faster recharge times - they already have experience and usually better equipment - why the extra advantage in a scrap?

It would seem logical that Excal-Lite with 4 missiles should regenerate in half the time (only 4 missiles to recreate) - overall you would still fire at the average rate as now - 4 missiles in 90 secs = 8 missiles in 180 secs.

Thinks . . . however, anyone being "creative" could have two Lite packs and lob off 4+4 fairly quickly and regenerate both in 90 secs so there might be a much lowered demand for a full pack.

Thinks a bit more: perhaps the "launch trigger electronics" built into the ship needs to recover/recharge so if you carry two Lite packs you can only fire them at 90 sec intervals.

it would pan out something like this:

time 0 secs: fire Lite Pack 1 - trigger just depleted
time 90 secs: fire Lite Pack 2 - Lite Pack 1 regenerated but trigger just depleted again firing Pack 2
time 180 secs: fire Lite Pack 1 - Lite Pack 2 regenerated but trigger just depleted yet again firing Pack 1

and so on

The overall result is that explorers can have a Lite defence and combat pilots can actually choose between a loadout with a full pack fired every 180 secs or two Lite packs fired every 90 secs.

That would give you Lite guys and gals what you want and go towards my desire for a bit of flexibility in the "8 missiles and wait" of the full pack with all the downside of wasted missiles and collateral damage

:P and, hee hee hee, if there was a Super Lite 2 missile option firing 2 missiles every 45 seconds I would have the choice of fitting single fire, burst fire or the full monty Excaliburs, though not being able to change between them in space! Still better than at present!

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:12 am

I like to keep things "uncomplicated". Just the 4pack, same 3 min reload, That would make me happy.

Nubarus · Post by **Nubarus** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 7:51 pm

From post: 103867, Topic: tid=7372, author=MMaggio wrote:I like to keep things "uncomplicated". Just the 4pack, same 3 min reload, That would make me happy.

Same here, no need to add complicated timers at all.
Just keep the system the same, only cut it in half.