X52 and saitek pro rudder pedals?

hello · Post by **hello** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:54 pm

Hello

I also posted this in tech fourms but thought maybe this be better considering where its at.

This game looks amazing but i cant fly it till i get all my gear working

I also see they are trying to support this stuff more than other games ive been reserching to play

here is my problem

First i havent even left starting point in demo

Track ir seems to work well

X52 seems to be fine

Iam using most recent demo with multi control support
X52 on controller 1 fine.

Saitek pro rudder pedals on controller 2 is only finding the toe breaks . Left toe break is axis one and right toe break axis 2. The main rudder axis is not being found the back and forth motion.

Ive tried the saitek progamming software and ppjoy (couldnt make that one work at all)

I know gear is good as i also play fight sims online and off also in windows all controllers are found and working perfectly.

Ok my question is has anyone made the X52 joystick and saitek pro rudder pedals both work in this game.

Ive seen a fella named vice talking about the x52 being used on development computer could ya also get some saitek pro pedals connected?

Because i hope iam not alone here but if you can make a good space combat flight sim with track ir, joystick, throttle and rudder pedal supprot, it would just be amazing and you also would be ahead of alot of these fellas out there.

Ive reserched a bit lately on these type of games, the ones with cockpit view. This one seems best by far and with track ir support big bonus also your controller support seems best so far. (even know i cant get rudder to work)

I also use 42 inch lcd monitor, i basicly have a online ww2 online combat flight sim in my computer room with all my gear hooked up. I would love to have a nice combat space sim. This one looks close to what ive been wanting so far outa the ones ive seen. (just controller support very bad in others)

I my self think controller support is very big unless ya trying to be pure arcade. Its also what we use to interface with your game. Put bad tires on a race car what ya got.

Anyways again my question is has anyone got the saitek pro rudder pedals working with demo or game with multi controller support (most recent relesed ones)

Devs if ya be so kind can ya tell me if rudder pedals are supported or will they be supported.

Trust me hook them rudder pedals up with good support and ya wont want to fly without them. (twisty handle just makes wrist hurt hehe) and add throttle, joystick, track ir and 42 inch lcd monitor and say oh my?.

Sorry for spelling and grammer have fun and hope ya can help (and understand me))

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:31 pm

I am sure this game will accept input from the pedals as well as the X52. I know the X52, but don't have the pedals. I seem to remember that Vice has gone thru this before.
There is an update for the game that supports multiple inputs. it's possible that the demo version does not have that, tho' that sounds odd.
Best resolve this with Vice when he comes on.

Post by **Vice** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 12:37 am

Try the latest 1.058 build ( http://www.starwraith.com/evochron_legends.exe ), I've added some new control options into this build to better support more device axis channels. From the updated instructions:

Both the axis menu and key/button menu also let you change the current device in case you have more than one game controller connected to your computer. Use the '<<<<' and '>>>>' arrows at the top to change the control device while you are mapping axis channels or buttons. To test which device is currently active, simply press buttons on it or move it around to observe which input signals are responding. You can select a different device while you are mapping controls, so you can bind each function to a different device as desired. The game supports up to 10 control devices simultaneously. The first six axis channels available in the menu are matched with the device you select, channels 7-10 use a separate input system that provides additional input options for some devices. You can manually control input selection for channels 7-10 using the method explained in the technical notes section below.

From the technical notes section:
For multiple control devices, you can also select different input signals for channels 7-10 if the default settings fail to detect the device you want to use. By default, axis channels 1-6 are bound to the device you select in the Configure Controls menu and channels 7-10 are secondary using an alternate input system. This can be useful if your using a device that does not return a signal on one or more of the device bound axis channels. To change the device assignment for channels 7-10, create a text file in the game's folder named device2set.txt and in the first line enter the number of the device you want to use. The value may need to be different than the selected device for the other set of axis channels.

I would recommend trying the device2set.txt option with the number 2 entered as the value. You should then be able to pick up 3 dedicated axis channels on the pedals in device slot 2, including roll control.

[Edited on 3-16-2009 by Vice]

hello · Post by **hello** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:57 am

Hello ty vice for reply

OK first no matter what ive done i get same result

using demo 1.058 I know rudder axis works, its ok in two other games and windows finds all ok.

In game options i set to joystick/gamepad. In controller one it finds joystick. throttle axes all work ok . In controller two it seems to find the rudder pedals but it just finding the toe breaks. Toe break on left is axis one rigt toe break is axis two. If i move main rudder axis no sliders move showing no output.

So iam thinking the rudder pedals have 3 axis? Both toe brakes have one axis each and main back and forth rudder motion is one axis. So can i say the game is finding rudder pedals on controller two, it finds two axes which are toe breaks. So the main axis back and forth motion not detected.

Ive tried device2set.txt ive tried 0 thru 10 for number of device, so only text i put into txt file was a number. I tried values 0 to 10.

I cant think of anything else beside game not supporting the rudder pedals as its finding them but something wrong .

Again vice (if not already have) get pair of saitek pro rudder pedals and hook it up with your x52 and track Ir (hope ya have large screen lcd) You will be very happy trust me rudder pedals add so much to controlling something. I know you probaly have alot on your plate with this game already but something to think about.

Ive been computer gaming since 1991 ive become a tad jaded with games nowadys. Ive been trying to find space combat sim that supports all my gear now. THis is only one still on my harddrive and even care to try and make it work. This is from what others have said about this game and graphics ive seen. Also features ive read about and the little of me flying around at start point. I can see there could be alot of fun here. Iam the type of player that can have fun just flying around a spacestaion doing manuvers just having fun flying.

What iam trying to say is i cant fly without rudder pedals no more, joystick twisty axis hurts my wrist and just not pedals eh. I will keep checking out this game and trying to think of soultion to my rudder pedal problem. So hopefully someday all my gear will work and i can fly in your world ya created.

Btw i also read saitek fourms nothing there helped.

again sorry for spelling grammer have fun and hope ya can help. /salute

hello · Post by **hello** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:03 am

Iam sorry but I forgot

My big question is has anyone got any kind of rudder pedals working in this game .

have fun

Post by **Vice** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:11 am

Ok, unfortunately, if 1.058 with the device2set method isn't working, then it may just not work with your setup for some reason. 1.058 re-introduces the original control configuration for axis channels 7-10 that worked with rudder pedals (perhaps not Saitek, but CH and some others). So if even the original method that worked previously does not work on your system now, then it probably won't be possible to get it to function and there may some other cause. It also means that both the new control system and the original used by the development language do not or may not support Saitek's rudder pedals for some reason.

I do not have Saitek rudder pedals to test with and it's not in my budget to buy some. So if another player has them, they may be able to offer further assistance. Have you tried their SST software?

[Edited on 3-16-2009 by Vice]

hello · Post by **hello** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 4:24 am

again ty for reply

Ok ive treid sst software ppjoy(couldnt get that at all working) device2txt fix. also had rudder pedals only controller on my system and still same results. All drivers most recent.

I also know windows finds the controllers perfectly. I have two games i play aces high 2 and falcon 4.0 rudder works perfectly in them. Plus ive had other stuff where rudder worked fine. I also had working in another space combat sim out but was not a good game and control setup they had suked.

Dont take this wrong but ya say 58 build controller support has worked in past with saitek pro rudder pedals. So iam thinking if ya not have the control device to test in shop how ya really know if it worked or ya must have talked to someone who used said rudder pedals in this game.

Again i cant see it being my setup but somehting with the game. Unless someone can come on here and say they got it up and running with pedals. (i so hope any kind of pedals)

I know ya not have it now but maybe in future something to think about. Be nice selling point to be able to say for sure YOu know saitek x52 and rudder pedals plus track ir works for sure with a system that is properly configured with said devices. (dont take this in wrong way) If ya not have device how can you know for sure they work with your build. As these devices are easy to get dont cost to much considering what they use to be and are decent quality.

You cant belive with all 3 of these devices working what kind of experience ya get. It adds so much to your imersion in game. Your just not controlling where ship is going you are flying the ship where ya going keyword flying. You become a part of it. ( also add a large over 40 inch lcd oh my)

This game caught my intrest mostly because it has in ship cockpit view and talked about trying to give sim feeling to game considering it in space. (does anyone know how that all works out) To me ya need good controller support for that unless arcade is what ya going for i havnt flown enough in game to get feel but what i did felt interesting.

Again i will stick around till someday it all works out hopefully, because i gota check this game out hehe. I wont fly till i get rudder working as twisty stick hurts wrist plus that twisty motion gets in way of what ya need to do.

Iam not saying it my side or your side, but i do know my side better than yours and it seems to be fine in other stuff but not here. I have no idea but frustrating with out knowing.

Again i will keep checking to see if someone replys who has got the rudder pedals up and working in this game.

Rember this i think your support for x52 is great but think about these rudder pedals. Because it is the only way to fly anything if ya think about it. (especially combat flight) When i started this game it didnt even say ya even supported them so i was just hoping they would work, not your fault. You have been very kind with quick replys to my problem.

Btw iam just saying alot of this suff to let ya know some peeps like me find controller support very important in games. Not saying you are lacking or not thinking about it, I just want you to Know how a certian crazy customer thinks about it. Iam so looking for a space combat game to lean more towards realistic sim? (as can be).

Have fun ill be glad to even call ya long distance or give ya any details ya need to know so can get to bottom of this.

hello · Post by **hello** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:24 am

hello

Ok i read fourms more and found out i was using devie2set wrong it was device2set.txt.txt

So changed that

now i get runtime error 160 when launch game

i tried all values only worked when value was 0 all other values gave error. when set 0 i dont get runtime error but same rudder problem main rudder action not found

i reinstalled game

I started game with rudder unplugged and device2set value 2 didnt get runtime error, also i didnt get msg about starting or plugging in controller as ive seen ya talk about in other post. i did see at top it said in white it has found controller and i should config it. It only listed controller one so i plugged in rudder and it did nothing wont even let me use arrows to go to controller 2 of course.

so basicly device2set with value2 or any beside 0 with rudder plugged in at lauch of game it will give me runtime error 160. rudder unplugged of course boots up but no controller 2 found even if plug in after game starts nothing

If i set device2set value to 0 it launches but of course same prob as before no rudder axis

sst sofware suks as cant change axis betwen toe breaks and rudder axis

dx finds my x52 as controller 0 and pedals as controller 1

i also changed stick list to same no dif even if I leave it at default 1 and 2 it seems not to matter

have fun still trying salute
Iam tierd hope ya understood me

btw seen two peeps with ch say they got working that was in 2007 but no saitek users yet

[Edited on 3-16-2009 by hello]

hello · Post by **hello** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:05 pm

hello

Ok more info i dont know how i missed this other day

ok with no device2set if i unplug the x52 and launch game with rudder pedals plugged in the game finds all 3 axis but its strange, controller one reports rudder motion as axis 10 no toe brakes. I also can go to controller two it reports my toe breaks same as before left toe is axis one right toe axis 2 and the rudder motion is axis 10. So it reporting rudder motion as axis 10 for both controller one and two?

OK when i plug in just x52 launch game i can only acces controller one unlike when rudder alone it can acces controller one and two. Also the x52 twist motion is being reported on axis 4 and 10. now if plug in both controllers it same as orginal problem

So what i wondering is the twist motion axis 4 and 10 on controller one taking over the rudder motion axis that also when its alone on axis 10 on controller one and two. when both plugged in i lose the axis 10 for rudder motion in controller one and two, strange eh? of course toe breaks always same axis in controller two. Also stange that twist motion axis is being reported as 2 axis 4 and 10. so is the x52 twist motion sharing channel with rudder pedals 10?

Man i hope that made sense

Also i can set any value with device2set with x52 plugged in no error. I only get runtime error if rudder pedals are conected alone or not, seems not to like rudder pedals. only value 0 works sticklist not matter what set at it seems.

ok hope this helps gonna keep trying but something def up wtih twist motion and rudder motion both on axis 10 maybe?

have fun

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:15 pm

What kind of graphics card are you using?,
I get runtime error 160 on my computer at work, and I do not have any
pedals period. Computer has NVIDIA Graphics card, And I have to keep foolling around with the resolution to get the demo at work to work.

I do not have a problem at home like this! I only get runtime error 160
sometimes at home after exiting EL the full game. I have the X52 at home,
and an Visiontek ATI RADEON X1300 512MB!

It might be a combination of factors that affect the pedals control maybe they are sensitive to certain resolution on your 42" lcd, and your graphics card.

Hope this helps

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:48 pm

I hate to be the one who tells you this, and I admit I do not have a set of pedals, but do have an X52. But it sounds more & more like a corrupted install. You say the toe brakes work but not the rudder. That is very interesting. Obviously the game is seeing the the pedals, just mis-interpreting the action.
Again, I do not have a set of pedals, but suspect that the SST progam would likely solve this problem.
I know you said everything works fine in other games, but obviously Legends "sees" the footpedals, but only recognises the "brake". That sounds like a programming problem to me
But I could be wrong. I would think it easily corrected via the SST program.
Have you tried calling the Saitek tech support direct? They have always been most helpful to me. 310-972-9930. Ask for "Alex". They are in California, USA.
Good luck! MM

[Edited on 3-17-2009 by MMaggio]

hello · Post by **hello** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 2:45 am

hello again

I have the 8800 gts card and yeah i only get that error if i use device2set with any value beside 0 with rudder pedals connected.

Remeber if i hook up just rudder pedals they work just strange what i said 2 posts up

there is a problem when x52 and rudder both connected i have feeling some kind of sharing going on in game as stick twist motion is using same axis as what pedals rudder motion would use .

yeah i need to call saitek but have feeling it something with this games dual control suppot as each control device works in game when connected alone. It strange that rudder pedals use both controller 1 and 2 when conected alone, it uses axis 10 in both controller one and two and toe breaks are only found in controller 2 axis 1 and 2. Now with x52 connected alone it just offes controller 1 cant acces controller 2 as with rudder pedals alone. with x52 alone the twist motion is reporting on two of the axes 4 and 10.

Now if i connect both i lose the axis 10 for rudder in both controller setups, twist motion still 4 and 10. so to me it seems like something between twist motion axis and rudder motion axis??

Again if pedals connected alone they work just strange where it uses controller 1 and 2 and uses both axis 10 with both and in the controller 2 it seems right as toe breaks found on axes 1 and 2 and rudder motion axis 10. (remeber if x52 connected alone it can jsut acces controler one no option for controller 2 like rudder alone.

So iam wondering is it something with twist and rudder motion axis. Something with this game dual controller support. first i havnt seen anyone who use both say they got them working. Plus they work perfect in windows and my other games, if i was having problems with other games yeah i say my system has problem. Again rudder pedals connected alone are picked up just that stange way it using both controller one and 2 axis 10 on both and remeber stick twist motion is also being reported as axis 4 and 10 in controller one??

man i hope made sense i so bad explaining myself thru chat.

anyways iam going to keep trying, i feel if call saitek i know what they gonna say, well they work in other stuff windows find perfect. They will tell me to talk to game support. Maybe who knows but that usaully what happens right cuase they not know about game. What can they do really as everything fine beside this game. (my rudders work)

I think saitek should give this man a free pair of pedals for development of his game as it helps both companys as peeps may buy thier rudder pedals to play this if advertised as wroks great with this game. (win win)

anyways i really have no idea what problem is iam going to keep trying see if can get more info for ya

have fun
btw i still think this man whos a one man team is amazing he puts these bigger companys to shame way he handles his tech support. its so nice and refreshing he has even tried considering i havnt seen anything about this game supporting my setup. (iam the one bugging him to get it to work hehe)

anyways salute

btw i forgot yeah ill check out sst more but it kinda suk as cant change axes.

[Edited on 3-17-2009 by hello]

Post by **Vice** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 3:33 am

SST may work, it's something to try. I think you can do things like change axis channels, but I may be wrong.

As for the X52 returning two signals for twist, that is normal. It returns a primary signal on axis channel 4 and a secondary signal on channel 10. You can map either one (the deadzone and precision range can vary a bit between the two).

I will work on some ideas for the setup you're using. Even though I don't have the pedals to test with, I can change some code to try and detect the signals it presents to DirectInput. In particular, the error code you encountered offers a clue as to what can be added/changed (with the device2set.txt option specifically). I may have a test build ready for you to try some time tomorrow.

[Edited on 3-17-2009 by Vice]

Post by **Vice** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:20 am

Ok, here is the test build:

http://www.starwraith.com/evochron_legendsb.exe

After installing this, use the device2set.txt file option and try number 2 to start with. You should no longer receive the error 160 message and this may work to pick up the additional channel.

[Edited on 3-17-2009 by Vice]

hello · Post by **hello** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:50 am

Hello

Well ty very much

I cant test my sst software again for a few more hours but will. Im preaty sure i cant change twist motion aixs and almsot positive cant change rudder axis either.

My rudder pedals motion axis is deffiently being reported on 10 with only devie on system. both controler one and two that makes me really wonder about twist and rudder motion axis since twist also 4 and 10. Thats also good to know twist on your machine is also 4 and 10.

Anyways ch gear is diffrent than saitek as in ch throttle, stick, rudder pedals usb each has its own connection into computer. Where saitek rudder pdeals has it own and the x52 combines throttle and stick and twist thing into one connection into computer. The fellas in fourms with ch gear that they got running sounded like they had no throttle. So were they connecting alot less stuff in way?? I see iam very clueless about some of this stuff now, but what iam trying to say is the throttle, twisty and joystick single connection causing prob on saitek stuff, when rudder is also added with its own connection. The game has So many axes it dealing with, meaning it really more than just 2 controllers it seeing So basicaly some kinda conflict on channel 10??

also ch programing software looks to better than sst software. I also wondering and hopefully it can be dont with out saitek software getting better/changed, so you can change or disable axes on thier devies. Seems like they would of put that in at start if was easy to do>?

I so wish i knew more about how all this stuff worked iam more a gamer than tech.

Anyways ill help ya with whatever ya need.

Hope this setup can work with game be very intersting if does, ill will have a space ship in my computer room hehe. I also did think about something tho with the twist motion on stick in this type of game you would really want to use the twisty motion and rudder motion for some type of movement as that would make you more efficent, so really with space ship in 3d space no gravity you would need as much control input as you could get right? So really earlier i said id not like to use it just the rudder motion, i was wrong that deffiently mind thinking about regular planes as twist for rudder control very bad to have on stick. But if i you gota use it in this type of sim, i will just figure out some way it wont hurt my wrist as it does gota have it all working right? ( hope made sense)

Have fun as always sorry for spelling grammer hope ya get me?

Again i gota say amazing tech support. salute
hoping can find solution

hello · Post by **hello** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:06 am

hello

ok here results

with device2set value 2 no runtime error now

in game still cant find the rudder motion with both controllers hooked up

axes changed tho in controller one the twist axes is 4 and not using 10 its now just 4.

rudder in controller one toe breaks using 1 axis each left toe using axis 7 and right toe using axis 8

rudder in controller two toe breaks using 2 axes each left toe break is 1 and 7 the right toe is 2 and 8.

and of course no rudder motion detected

with rudders connected alone with device2set value 2 set it will only find toe breaks as old problem no rudder motion.

with rudders connected alone without device2set it picks them up controller one axis 10 controller 2 also axis 10 and the toe breaks axis one and two are picked up in controller 2.

sst software only thing i can see is rempaing keys nothing with axes wont even disable them. If someone who reads this knows more please yell.

I will check the sst software out more or call them but man i sure they will say talk to game. Iam thinking sst doing what its says and widows finds pefectly. Will they maybe just say the game just might not be supporting multiple controls. The only two games i have that I know for sure who say they are supporting multi controllers are working perfect with my gear. There could be something I missing some kinda hack to change axes as i can live without toe breaks but it would be nice if all worked. But again not looking so good with sst program.

BTW this games says nothing about supporting multiple controllers. (that ive seen) so it just amazing support iam getting i gota say best in all my game years.

Have fun ill keep trying

Post by **Vice** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 4:13 pm

Ok, lets see if there is any input signal available I can use for the pedals. Download this ZIP, extract the files, then run the dbc_test.exe file. A bunch of numbers will appear in the window. Move the rudder pedals back and forth and see if any of the displayed numbers changed with that movement. If it does, just let me know which one.

http://www.starwraith.com/ControlTest.zip

[Edited on 3-17-2009 by Vice]

hello · Post by **hello** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:17 am

hello
Ok i dont know if doing this right. The 0 gets replaced by square white box as i move axis. I see no numbers unless i hit a button and that gets recorded in middle line thats longest with a number.

here is what i seen when moved axes of controllers. Number 0 gets shaded in with white box as move axis.

1st line

0>throttle
0>twist
0
0

2nd line

0
0>stick
0>stick
0>throttle
0>twist
0
0

3rd line

this line buttons get recorded with numbers over 0

4th line

-100 that it nothing happens here

5th line

1
0>Ltoe
0>Rtoe
-100
0>rudder motion
-100
-100

this with both controller connected

ok let me know if did wrong or need more info

have fun and big ty again for still trying

ok i gota edit this to get rows some how

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

Post by **Vice** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:58 am

I think that works, but I don't want to get the wrong input, so just to be sure, can you snap a screenshot of the screen and mark on the image which value changes for the rudder? You can take a screenshot by pressing the Print Screen key, then pasting the image from memory in an image editor. You can e-mail it to me at this address: http://www.starwraith.com/contact.htm

hello · Post by **hello** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:09 am

hello

Ok i offically have no idea how to do that Doh

Ok ive never had to do this before

nothing seems to happen when hit print screen

Iam totally clueless here hehe

i dont even see hd activity maybe my print screen not working, what should happen when i hit print screen key while looking at desktop??

do they get added to a folder somewhere??

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

[Edited on 3-18-2009 by hello]

Post by **Vice** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:21 am

Nothing will happen, it just gets copied to memory when you press the key. Once that's done, open an image editor, like Paint, then click on Edit > Paste Image to make is visible. Then save the image as a JPG and attach it to an e-mail.

hello · Post by **hello** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:37 am

Ok sent it

Let me know if need more

Post by **Vice** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:43 am

Got it and now I know which channel I need to include a scan for. I will add it to the game and should have a test build ready for download within about an hour. I will post here again when it's ready for download.

Post by **Vice** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:02 am

Ok, the test build is ready for download (you can just download this installer and run it to install over an older build):

http://www.starwraith.com/evochron_legendsb.exe

The rudder pedals should now show up on axis channel 7 in the configure controls menu. If this works, I'll make it part of the official update.

hello · Post by **hello** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:47 am

hello and argh

Not work

result

ok no device2set axes same as before no rudder found

with device2set value 2 no rudder found.

controller one Right toe break is axis 8

controller two right toe break axis 2 and 8. the left toe break is axis 1

and of course no rudder motion found

have fun and yell if need more info ill keep checking and big ty for time effort