New Frames & Inventory Console Features

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:45 am

Ah yes! I adore Armored Core! The introduction of more optional and customizable slots for these things would be awesome!
Like the equipment slots, but with system improvements, like the "targeting computer" that takes 40 "slots", "fuel saver" that takes 20 slots, "signal jammer" that takes 50 slots etc etc..
Every frame with its own "slots" or something like build points, to give more space and possibilities to the player to customize their frames!

Also enlarge or restrict the gunsight. Why all weapons whould have the same gunsight? Maybe there are "sniper" ones that have a great range and are powerful, but with a very narrow sight, others like machineguns that have a wider sight, but are less powerful and with limited range...
And items to enlarge the gunsight, using the "system slots" I described...

Just random ideas...but Armored Core was so great in customization!

(Also the possibility to add pictures and badges on my military frame or change a bit its color would be very nice... and why not mimetic patterns?

:D:D)

Flying Brick · Post by **Flying Brick** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 8:13 pm

From post: 109838, Topic: tid=7616, author=Rush wrote:Vice would be (even more) my hero, if instead of the MDTS he programs a funnel

A funnel is the best way existent in modern fighters to predict the trajectory of your gunfire. In this way the ability needed to hit your targets would be reeeeeally demanding.

For example you could leave all the guns like they are (with MDTS) but make powerful and low-energy consuming gun with funnels, and not MDTS (for some in-game reason )
In this way a pilot could choose an easy-to-use and reliable but not very performing gun which uses MDTS, others could choose more powerful and at the same time low-energy consuming guns, which are very hard to use (have you ever tried a military flight simulator? If yes, you know what I mean with hard :D:D).

[...]

In fact there's the possibility to deactivate the MDTS, but why? Right now it's only a problem if you accidentally press L button and deactivate it

However, the key concept is "more asymmetry"

[Edited on 2-7-2011 by Rush]

I like your suggestions! I haven't played modern mil flight sims, but I think we're thinking along very similar lines

(would you happen to have a screenshot of what you're talking about?)

Also, since, as you point out, there is no real reason to turn MDTS on right now, it is possible that Vice already had some future development in mind regarding this, but he just hasn't got around to implementing the tradeoff yet.
But it would make sense for there to be a tradeoff: you can use MDTS and benefit from easier targeting, or...right now, there is no "or". But there could be

And yeah, as per your suggestion, the in-game justification could be that the non-MDTS weaponry uses less energy (MDTS itself would consume some of your power), and therefore is more efficient...yeah, this idea could be going somewhere!

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 8:15 pm

Flying Brick thanks for your post and most of all for your name.

I laugh so much every time i read it

:D:D

Here it comes:

As you see, in the center of the HUD there's something like a windsock. That's the funnel. It is used to predict the trajectory of your gunfire.
The shots in fact fly in parabolas towards the ground. Usually when you have a gun or a rifle you have a way to aim and to predict that parabola.
On an airplane it's not so easy, because you move continuously, and there's the wind etc..
So the funnel tells you where the bullets will go: the objective is to make the wings of the other airplane more or less coincide with the width of the funnel. In this way the bullets will (or better, should!) hit the enemy.
You see that the funnel makes curves, because the trajectory of the bullets depend on the way you move

It's very hard to hit something with a thing like that, but an experienced and trained pilot can make it

[Edited on 2-7-2011 by Rush]

Flying Brick · Post by **Flying Brick** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:10 pm

Rush, thank you very much for the screenshot and the explanations!
I get it now, and yes, of course, the shape of the trajectory makes perfect sense. Yes, something like that would be awesome indeed.
Lest it be misunderstood, I (and presumably others as well) am not suggesting we should do away with the MDTS - on the contrary, it certainly is a welcome feature, and I think it helps a lot, especially for new players, or players who prefer less combat and more non-combat stuff (exploring, mining, trading, etc). So MDTS is good

, don't throw it away!

And Rush, if you laugh at my name, wait until you see me flying!

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:30 pm

Another small thing I noticed- There's a pretty major size scaling problem. I mean, things you see while inside the cockpit (Buildings, terrain, capital ships) are actually MUCH larger then they look, compared to your vessel (Check them out in 3rd person as well).

Not sure if it's something that can be repaired so easily- probably an engine limitation? Anyway, would be nice to have that fixed.

d3drocks · Post by **d3drocks** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:45 pm

Ability to fly capital ships would be nice.

would also be nice to be able to have more than 1 ship.

being able to hire crews to fly your second (or 3rd, or w/e) ship with objectives you give them (such as mining, combat, etc) would be awesome as well.

maybe some more kinds of plant life on the planets (on higher graphical settings of course), to make them look a little nicer.

some more options for colouring your ship, such as colouring by individual part, or to be able to use the mouse to paint the ship (kind of like trackmania does with its car customization i guess).

"autodock" with stations as an optional way to dock would be nice, especially for beginners (one of my buddies bought EM at the same time I did, and he still cant aim into the stations LOL).

for people who fly with the mouse, how about toggling the mouse to click things, instead of having to hold alt.

maybe a hotkey to pull up mission objectives instead of having to pull up the inventory (that could make it cover less of the screen for that function).

optional story as someone said above.

Post by **Marvin** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:57 pm

From post: 109928, Topic: tid=7616, author=d3drocks wrote:...optional story as someone said above.

Exists. As does the option to write your own story.

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:16 pm

Some of the things you ask are already there

You can hire a crew, but only in SP. Trade with them: they cost and they're not that good, but they can be hired. In MP you just have to ask the other people!

More than one ship? You can. Just drop your ship in a hangar, then buy another one

Of course you'll have to pay the hangar fee...

But most of all...you fly with the mouse??? Are you sure that the keyboard is not waaay better?

:D:D

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:33 pm

Currently, the fleet and story features are simply very bare-bones, though.. I'm glad they're there, but there's a lot of room for improvment and expansion.

I'm trying to imagine the X series' depth with Evochron's amazing gameplay.. it could topple the competition, or at least give it a run for it's money!

Time to put on my harsh hat (Don't forget I love the game

)-
With the upcoming X: Rebirth, the series will offer great depth with an amazing graphics system. I realize the Evochron games won't reach that graphics level soon, what with it being made by 1 guy and all- so the only other option to make the next game profitable/noticable in the market is purely by gameplay improvments. Starwraith games have been gaining attention lately, and I only hope Vice can keep the momenteum going in the chaotic and uncertain world that is the gaming market.
I think he has what it takes.

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:46 pm

I still don't understand why people want to fly a capital ship, you cannot do anything with it, just fly forward very very slowly and turn even slower.
You cannot opperate any weapons yourself since the capital ships have turrets and no forward facing cannons since that will be as useful as shooting a tank with a paintball gun.

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:55 pm

Personally I'm not big on the whole capital spaceship thing (See what I did there, hur hur), but there's certainly a considerable crowd who love piloting them.

You can make it so their pilot will be more of a captain- giving it coordinates to fly towards, configuring weapon systems, and giving direct commands to it's fighter craft.
It could have even larger cargo holds, so people who put money into it could become filthy rich, even forming corporations!
It could make for some very interesting gameplay situations- imagine a capital ship trying to make a jump to dock near a station, only to be interrupted mid jump (because of a virus in the jump systems or something), and it would have to fight it's way out of an ambush!

One can certainly understand the romance of commanding a huge battleship!

Oh man, now I'm starting to want this too...

[Edited on 7-3-2011 by Jack Dandy]

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:00 pm

Ah sure a battleship could be nice...if they weren't so weak

:D:D

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:04 pm

There's always room for improvments, Rush! And capitalships are no exception

I just keep on preaching my message- Starwraith games have unlimited potential just waiting to be tapped.

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:37 pm

This game is build as a solo survivor, kind of like Han Solo in his Millenium Falcon, therefor the capital ships here are very weak, a single ship with a skilled pilot in it can attack a capital ship + escort and win without getting a dent.

If they make capital ships flyable in it's current stage you better bring 50 fighters as an escort.

If they make the capital ships more deadly, like for example the capital ships from Freespace, there even a Leviathan class cruiser will tear you a new one if you attack it on your own John Wayne style and they are the weakest capital ships in that game.

So for the sake of ballance I am fairly sure we will never see a flyable capital ship in EM.

As for getting filthy rich, you really don't need a capital ship for that, you can get filthy rich in any ship, especially in one that can carry 5 cargo bays.

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:38 pm

Some tech data on the Leviathan

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:41 pm

With proper gameplay balancing, I'm certain there can be a balance between the flying coffins of EM and the deadly juggernauts of the Freespace games.
And it could make fine gameplay addition, too!

He shouldn't focus just on that, though. This thread is mostly an idea dump. Hoping he looks at it every now and then

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:10 pm

Well, in all honesty, as soon as people can command a deadly capital ship nobody but the new people will fly a small ship anymore.

I like how it is, more like the tv series Firefly, a relative small ship with a small crew doing whatever you want to do.
Now you actually need some practice and skill to obtain your goals, having to just jump in and spew death around you in a massive bloat boat takes all the skill away from it, unless you slug it out with other bloat boats, everything else becomes errelevant, including new players in their little flies.

Just imagine this, some new kid joins the game, comes online on R1 flying his little Talon, runs into some trouble and asks for some backup, then some guy jumps in flying a battleship and blows up everything, makes playing the game for new people very boring very soon.

Come to think of it, I will find that boring too to play the game in a battleship but you would be pretty much forced to fly one if you want to compete in anything because let's face it, the majority of the people playing will use the biggest badest thing they can find and in MP warlike environment you either fly the big stuff or you get plowed over.

Edit: Noticed a typo

[Edited on 7-3-2011 by Avenger]

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:18 pm

Hmmm.. know what, you actually have a pretty good point.

But it could go 2 sides though- one like the one you mentioned, or the other- players banding together and showing that you need more then just a big fancy capital ship to take down true aces! Giving true purpose to clans and stuff like that!
Think about it, man. This isn't CoD or some Korean F2P MMORPG. Remember we have a good community here, which I don't think will abuse power in such a rude manner.

tl;dr I understand what you're saying, but with proper balancing, I definitely think it could work out somehow.
Maybe if a fully-powered capital ship would compare to about 1.5 the strength of a good fighter craft, and would require huge amount of money to produce. Also, they would be geared more for battle against larger targets like enemy capital ships and stations. Smaller craft, even beginner ones, would simply be too speedy for them.

I think it could really expand the endgame.

[Edited on 7-3-2011 by Jack Dandy]

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:25 pm

Maybe hiring a transport to carry 5000 tons of goods, to improve for example the mining and massive commerce aspect.

Because it's a sim-trading-mining game, but the real money you do with weapons/items commerce.
I would like to see somebody getting really rich with mining!

Dingo · Post by **Dingo** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:39 pm

I think solar cleaning missions should all pay a million credits. Just because it would but funny to see teams of player coop cleaning... In capital ships.

Rush · Post by **Rush** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:40 pm

From post: 109946, Topic: tid=7616, author=Dingo wrote:I think solar cleaning missions should all pay a million credits. Just because it would but funny to see teams of player coop cleaning... In capital ships.

Cannot comment this sentence, only laugh

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

d3drocks · Post by **d3drocks** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:47 pm

From post: 109932, Topic: tid=7616, author=Jack Dandy wrote:Currently, the fleet and story features are simply very bare-bones, though.. I'm glad they're there, but there's a lot of room for improvment and expansion.

I'm trying to imagine the X series' depth with Evochron's amazing gameplay.. it could topple the competition, or at least give it a run for it's money!

Time to put on my harsh hat (Don't forget I love the game )-
With the upcoming X: Rebirth, the series will offer great depth with an amazing graphics system. I realize the Evochron games won't reach that graphics level soon, what with it being made by 1 guy and all- so the only other option to make the next game profitable/noticable in the market is purely by gameplay improvments. Starwraith games have been gaining attention lately, and I only hope Vice can keep the momenteum going in the chaotic and uncertain world that is the gaming market.
I think he has what it takes.

I can tell you right now that X rebirth will have very intrusive copy protection right off the bat. terran conflict had tages (extremely unethical in my books). I never got any of those games until I saw the DRM free version in the store. should they choose to use secu-rom, I would highly suggest no one get it, for the fact that secu-rom has rootkits in it, and can potentially open up your system to security issues (so can tages, but tages does it differently).
anyways, some of the X style things would fit great in evochron (gameplay wise). graphically, I do not mind where evochron is, because its not exceedingly bad. its good enough to really enjoy the game. problem with graphics is that Vice would have to hire people to help. I used to do a bit of 3D modeling myself, and I can tell you its a complete pain in the ass if you are doing it on your own. if he had to hire people to help, the price of the next game would probably go up. now, I`m a college student. I wouldn`t be able to afford much more than what mercenary is going for right now.

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 8:29 pm

I know man, I know. Expecting Vice to reach the graphical capabilities of a dedicated developer team is nothing but a pipedream- but as I said, he can back it up with superior gameplay! That's the secret formula of indie games!

Post by **DaveK** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:04 pm

From post: 109943, Topic: tid=7616, author=Avenger wrote:Well, in all honesty, as soon as people can command a deadly capital ship nobody but the new people will fly a small ship anymore.

I like how it is, more like the tv series Firefly, a relative small ship with a small crew doing whatever you want to do.
Now you actually need some practice and skill to obtain your goals, having to just jump in and spew death around you in a massive bloat boat takes all the skill away from it, unless you slug it out with other bloat boats, everything else becomes errelevant, including new players in their little flies.

Hi - this sums it up nicely - Firefly with a bit more agro!

If you want to fly a battleship - get hold of BattleCruiser
If you want to have a life spelled out for you, play Independence War or Freelancer
If you want to create your own life story play Evochron Mercenary

Post by **DaveK** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 9:09 pm

From post: 109944, Topic: tid=7616, author=Jack Dandy wrote:Hmmm.. know what, you actually have a pretty good point.

Remember we have a good community here, which I don't think will abuse power in such a rude manner.

But also remember that what Evochron has been and what it has evolved into is what has created the community it has. Give it battleships and even if the present team can resist the god urge to take over the universe, new people will be attracted to the game who won't resist because the battleships are what attracted them.

It might be a great game but it won't be EM - name another game like EM - if it goes then darn it!