Ships & Stations.

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 4:40 pm

EM is by far the best space sim ever created by the genius that is Vice, and the Leonardo Da Vinci of space sim gaming.

EM is the Michaelangelo of the genre, representing the Renaissance following the Dark Ages prototype space sim culture of the Wing Commanders, Tie Fighters, Freespacers and DarkStars, all the way up to the contemporary Celestial panoply of X3 universe and Eve whose mediocre game play is illustrated and out shadowed by the spectacular hard images of the X3 universes' buildings & stations, and Eve's spaceship design magnificence.

In spaceship/station illustration and design Vice. EM and AA fail in comparison.

The space ships, and stations look like they are the end product designs of illustrated "cocoa-puffs. You know. Those
breakfast food particles sold in supermarkets.

The ships lack the sleek & elegant look and design presented
to us feng shui starved PC gamers by Eve.

The stations lack the detailed texture and expansive glory also presented to us feng shui starved PC gamers by X3 universe.

We devoted disciples of Vice know that once he puts his mind & energies on a project, the project becomes an inspiration to his followers & competitors. Good Luck Pilot

[Edited on 2-6-2012 by XinCasa]

Post by **DaveK** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 5:09 pm

so . . . great gamepay and as open a sandbox as you could wish for with grittly realistic industrial design transferred into space

or . . . eye candy

hard choice?

Actually no, not for me - I would go for the Nostromo any day over the "hotels in space" that are the Enterprises and the pretty ships that lool like they are designed for atmospherric travel despie the fact they stay in space

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:19 pm

LOL....DaveK, I love Eye Candy only when it justifies the means and one day it will in Evochron....once I get a new computer system in 5 years maybe?...

:P

BÃ¦nlynn · Post by **BÃ¦nlynn** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:29 pm

I played X3 for two days and wanted to stab myself in the eyes with a fork. It's an inscrutable, overly-designed, and MILITANTLY counter-intuitive flowchart in a string bikini. Granted it's impressive-looking, but once you get past the chintz you see that the image of space porn before you is actually of your parents in the throes of passion on your childhood bed while you were off at summer camp...

I never heard anything about the gameplay in EvE that didn't make me feel the same way. The point and click business for starters...

Munshine · Post by **Munshine** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:56 pm

X3 and Eve space sims are you kidding ? A strategy game and an hack & slash !

Honestly these days most gamers especially the youngest look at the eye candy before the gameplay.

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:32 pm

From post: 129357, Topic: tid=8836, author=BÃ¦nlynn wrote:I played X3 for two days and wanted to stab myself in the eyes with a fork. It's an inscrutable, overly-designed, and MILITANTLY counter-intuitive flowchart in a string bikini. Granted it's impressive-looking, but once you get past the chintz you see that the image of space porn before you is actually of your parents in the throes of passion on your childhood bed while you were off at summer camp...

I never heard anything about the gameplay in EvE that didn't make me feel the same way. The point and click business for starters...[/quote]

oh my Baenlynn! Your telling expression of your childhood demons after experiencing X3 & Eve is bringing the wrathful memory of your parents as "space porn" into EM gameplay. Are you ok? Should we be concerned? Good Luck Pilot

Dingo · Post by **Dingo** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:38 pm

stations at least are getting an overhaul with the expansion.

I like the ships are they are, but admit to being very used to them, and thus, who knows what the right decision is in these matters? I trust Vice on that score, TBH. Although I want to be able to put my own decals on military ships, just because

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:52 pm

Hey guys. If you had your druthers which publisher would you want Vice to be bought out from: Eve or X3? My choice would be X3 cuz the station designs are unmatched, and the ship designs are ok. Good Luck Pilot

Viper · Post by **Viper** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:00 pm

Nothing is perfect. X3 and Eve have, as pointed out, flaws too. And although EM is an exceptionally well-designed game (certainly if you keep in mind that it is all done by one single man), EM is not perfect either. I would have to agree with you that if there is one element that is still lacking, it would be the ships and stations designs, mapping and texturing (although still better than those from Arvoch Alliance). If anything I wish this be improved in the future. The upcoming expansion features new station designs though. But not ships, I believe.

Then again, it would be boring if we had nothing to wish for. And as I said before, nothing is perfect.

[Edited on 2-6-2012 by Viper]

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:41 pm

'Sup Viper. I must respectfully disagree with you re "nothing is perfect." Although I concur with you on everything else.

My take is that everything is perfect. It''s the perception of the individual observer/witness that distorts perfection for purposes of self interest.

For example: Vices's ideas & imagination are perfect (as is your own). It's his attempt to represent them in the environment of conflicting self interest that distorts it.

"Nothing is as it seems" applies to perfection as it does to reality cuz other observers/witnesses are creating their own! Good Luck Pilot

[Edited on 2-6-2012 by XinCasa]

Viper · Post by **Viper** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:43 pm

I stand corrected, sir. You just made a most excellent point.

Are you a lawyer in real life?

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:00 pm

No I'm not. Hey Viper. I'm having a hella time fighting in space. Perhaps you can give me some pointers.

While fighting, my ids is turned off as instructed but i'm having trouble with missiles incoming. I try switching to ids intermittently, and/or turbo charging while ids is off to escape to no avail.

When I attempt to destroy the incoming (also using cm) i get tied down in missile fighting, and eventually get destroyed by them. What is your counsel Viper? Good Luck Pilot

[Edited on 2-6-2012 by XinCasa]

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:25 pm

From post: 129385, Topic: tid=8836, author=XinCasa wrote:'Sup Viper. I must respectfully disagree with you re "nothing is perfect." Although I concur with you on everything else.

My take is that everything is perfect. It''s the perception of the individual observer/witness that distorts perfection for purposes of self interest.

For example: Vices's ideas & imagination are perfect (as is your own). It's his attempt to represent them in the environment of conflicting self interest that distorts it.

"Nothing is as it seems" applies to perfection as it does to reality cuz other observers/witnesses are creating their own! Good Luck Pilot

[Edited on 2-6-2012 by XinCasa]

Simply put: Everything is relative!......A perfect example of relativity. If perfection is relative then relativity is relatively perfect.......

:P:P:P:P:P:P

Post by **Marvin** » Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:51 pm

From post: 129377, Topic: tid=8836, author=XinCasa wrote:Hey guys. If you had your druthers which publisher would you want Vice to be bought out from: Eve or X3?

Certainly not Eve ... "3rd person simulation" is a contradiction in terms. Why turn EM into a kiddie game? And, if X3 got ahold of it, you could kiss the seamless universe goodbye ... I doubt those guys even know how to code for anything other than a cluster of small boxes ... the kind where you can't get from one star system (another word for "map" when talking X3) to the other without using a jumpgate. Not to mention planetfall (if they managed to do that one, I'm sure it would be via a cut scene).

BÃ¦nlynn · Post by **BÃ¦nlynn** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 5:28 am

From post: 129377, Topic: tid=8836, author=XinCasa wrote:Hey guys. If you had your druthers which publisher would you want Vice to be bought out from: Eve or X3? My choice would be X3 cuz the station designs are unmatched, and the ship designs are ok. Good Luck Pilot

Neither. They'd be taking the intellectual property of one person and wouldn't be able to resist getting their greasy little fingerprints over it. If Evo became an Egosoft Product they'd just shoehorn the entire universe into their crappy little game engine--which they've been tinkering with for 10+ years but still can't get to work right--and you'd lose everything that made Evochron unique in the blink of an eye: seamless universe, planet transitions, configurable ships, All gone. EvE would turn the game into a new, improved version of the world's most-sadistic RPG. It'd be like playing GURPS with every edition of every supplement and only PhD mathematicians would be able to understand it.

If the game was to be published and actually be good: find Chris Roberts drag him out of Hollywood, pair him up with his brother again and get them to make a game. Given the appropriate LACK of interference from parent companies those two are to sim games what John Carmack is to the FPS.

So there you have it, Vice: In my opinion the only way the corporate arena could improve on what you've done with Evochron is to get TWO giants to stand on their own shoulders.

Viper · Post by **Viper** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:06 am

From post: 129388, Topic: tid=8836, author=XinCasa wrote:No I'm not. Hey Viper. I'm having a hella time fighting in space. Perhaps you can give me some pointers.

While fighting, my ids is turned off as instructed but i'm having trouble with missiles incoming. I try switching to ids intermittently, and/or turbo charging while ids is off to escape to no avail.

When I attempt to destroy the incoming (also using cm) i get tied down in missile fighting, and eventually get destroyed by them. What is your counsel Viper? Good Luck Pilot

Yeah dealing with the missiles can be tough at first.
Some groups of AI's will fire more missiles at you than others, but when you are beyond their firing range, they will definitely start throwing them around. So best thing is, although it may sound counter-intuitive, is not to drift too far from the battle group.
Engaging IDS when missiles being fired on you, only increases your ship's heat signature and will make it easier for the missiles to track you. So keep that off or only use to stabilize your ship more easily when there are no inbound missiles.
Best overall advice is to keep your ship in inertial mode and try to drift around the group of hostiles, using your afterburner and sideway strafe. watch your speed and make sure it never goes over approx. 1500, to make sure you don't drift too far from the battle group.
Try to keep your maximum distance to the AI's below say 1500, and start picking them off one by one, starting with those flying on the outside of the flock. Always keep your nose pointing forward, so you can see what the enemy is doing and blow up incoming missiles more easily. And when you're hit, boost the forward shield so it stays up. Start firing your weapons a split second before your target reaches your gun range, so he is the first to be knocked around by the impacts. This will make it harder for him to hit you. When an AI is firing at you, make sure you maintain a sideways motion of at least 500m/s at all times, this will throw off their MDTS and you won't get hit as often.

Buy an Auto-CM launcher first change you get, and upgrade your cm's to a minimum of 100 (4 pods). This will prove extremely helpful when dealing with missiles.

Finally, check out the Newbie info thread and watch some of the videos listed there. They will give you a good picture as to how to deal with a combat situation.

Good luck!

[Edited on 2-7-2012 by Viper]

Post by **Marvin** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 3:40 pm

From post: 129451, Topic: tid=8836, author=Viper wrote:Buy an Auto-CM launcher first change you get, and upgrade your cm's to a minimum of 100 (4 pods). This will prove extremely helpful when dealing with missiles.

Yes. Yes. Yes.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 5:00 pm

From post: 129470, Topic: tid=8836, author=Marvin wrote:
From post: 129451, Topic: tid=8836, author=Viper wrote:Buy an Auto-CM launcher first change you get, and upgrade your cm's to a minimum of 100 (4 pods). This will prove extremely helpful when dealing with missiles.
Yes. Yes. Yes.

I prefer to mannualy dispense counter measures and prefer the anti missile system. Because any missiles I miss shooting down or are coming from my six I can take care of with a few counter measures instead of the 5 the auto-launcher dispenses for every in coming missile, this way the antimissile system will take care of the occasional one that slips through! And I barely need to use CMs at all this way.....

Post by **Marvin** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 5:38 pm

I prefer not to bother. Using an auto-CM launcher, I can concentrate on the target. Missiles just roll right past me and I ignore them.

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:42 pm

From post: 129493, Topic: tid=8836, author=Marvin wrote: I prefer not to bother. Using an auto-CM launcher, I can concentrate on the target. Missiles just roll right past me and I ignore them.

That is good for twenty missiles heading your way at close range then you are out of CMs....And at the second folley of 20 missiles you better not mis one shooting them down!....

:P

XinCasa · Post by **XinCasa** » Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:06 pm

From post: 129451, Topic: tid=8836, author=Viper wrote:
From post: 129388, Topic: tid=8836, author=XinCasa wrote:No I'm not. Hey Viper. I'm having a hella time fighting in space. Perhaps you can give me some pointers.

While fighting, my ids is turned off as instructed but i'm having trouble with missiles incoming. I try switching to ids intermittently, and/or turbo charging while ids is off to escape to no avail.

When I attempt to destroy the incoming (also using cm) i get tied down in missile fighting, and eventually get destroyed by them. What is your counsel Viper? Good Luck Pilot
Yeah dealing with the missiles can be tough at first.
Some groups of AI's will fire more missiles at you than others, but when you are beyond their firing range, they will definitely start throwing them around. So best thing is, although it may sound counter-intuitive, is not to drift too far from the battle group.
Engaging IDS when missiles being fired on you, only increases your ship's heat signature and will make it easier for the missiles to track you. So keep that off or only use to stabilize your ship more easily when there are no inbound missiles.
Best overall advice is to keep your ship in inertial mode and try to drift around the group of hostiles, using your afterburner and sideway strafe. watch your speed and make sure it never goes over approx. 1500, to make sure you don't drift too far from the battle group.
Try to keep your maximum distance to the AI's below say 1500, and start picking them off one by one, starting with those flying on the outside of the flock. Always keep your nose pointing forward, so you can see what the enemy is doing and blow up incoming missiles more easily. And when you're hit, boost the forward shield so it stays up. Start firing your weapons a split second before your target reaches your gun range, so he is the first to be knocked around by the impacts. This will make it harder for him to hit you. When an AI is firing at you, make sure you maintain a sideways motion of at least 500m/s at all times, this will throw off their MDTS and you won't get hit as often.

Buy an Auto-CM launcher first change you get, and upgrade your cm's to a minimum of 100 (4 pods). This will prove extremely helpful when dealing with missiles.

Finally, check out the Newbie info thread and watch some of the videos listed there. They will give you a good picture as to how to deal with a combat situation.

Good luck!

[Edited on 2-7-2012 by Viper]

Thanks for the heads up Viper! Your instructions are right-on. My fighting has greatly improved. Missiles are no longer a threat. They're now merely obstacles. An Auto cm Launcher is on my equipment list. Good Luck Pilot

[Edited on 2-11-2012 by XinCasa]