When should I get a better engine?

Professor Paul1290 · Post by **Professor Paul1290** » Wed May 04, 2011 5:18 pm

Hi there, I'm kind of new to the game and have been playing quite a bit for the past couple weeks on the Remula One server.

I was wondering what the exact benefits of getting a better engine would be. Higher IDS speed is mentioned but that doesn't sound like that much of a benefit when you get higher speeds with IDS off.

I also see a value called "thrust" which I'm guessing is self explanatory and affects how well you accelerate, but I'm not sure how much of an impact this has. I've tried a couple different engines and haven't noticed that big of a difference.

I'm currently flying a Starmaster with a Voyage MkII engine.

49rTbird · Post by **49rTbird** » Wed May 04, 2011 6:21 pm

The bigger the Engine the faster and more efficient (less fuel) you travel. I trade off on Engine size if I need more build points for shields and wings. I believe the Thrust (afterburner effect) increases with the Engine size.

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Wed May 04, 2011 9:48 pm

I thought it was the other way around...
The bigger engine thrust capacity, the more Fuel it consumes.

49rTbird · Post by **49rTbird** » Wed May 04, 2011 10:24 pm

I believe you get a better return per unit of fuel considering you get better thrust.

Dave S · Post by **Dave S** » Thu May 05, 2011 12:57 am

Civian ships are definitely a balancing act between speed, agility, fuel capacity, survivability, and cargo. I recommend upping each capability equally when you first get a new frame (for noobies at least), try out how it handles on a few missions, and then begin tweeking to meet your needs (i.e. reduce fuel, but upgrade wings). That way you experience the differences and exactly how they benefit you in different circumstances.

I look forward to seeing you out there.

Ophiuchus · Post by **Ophiuchus** » Thu May 05, 2011 1:01 am

Just depends on how much mass and cubeage yer pushin' with the engine. With the game flight physics fully up to speed, engine/frame selection, utility, and "compatibility", play a decided role in base speeds. IDS multipliers really help in many roles; combat, contract, or cargo hauling. Certain frames seem to go better with certain ancillaries. Wing selection also plays a role, in the agility/maneuverability arena. There are trade-offs, engine for shield core; shield/cgo for wings. Amount of cargo capacity, number of fuel pods, and etc. Fuel utility is important to the combat pilot, merchant/trader, miner, racer, or merc. Period. Experiment with the frames and designs available, or morph your own, within of course, the game/sim parameters. And then, there are the weapons.

BraveHart · Post by **BraveHart** » Thu May 05, 2011 5:32 am

"Welcome Aboard Professor Paul1290"....Good advice from all of the above. Have fun putting together your own rig

Maarschalk · Post by **Maarschalk** » Sat May 07, 2011 3:25 pm

Hi Professor Paul1290, welcome to the game and forum. Hope to see you out there some time...

Post by **DaveK** » Wed May 11, 2011 5:33 pm

Hi - I've just had the stop watch out - the engine class affects the max speed you can reach - it has no effect on acceleration, regardless of IDS multiplier. With a class 8 engine at all multipliers it took 7 secs to reach 1000mps. It took 14 secs to reach 2000mps. I'm in a StarMaster frame

Swapped to a class 1 engine - had to use IDS x5 to actually be able to go at more than 1000mps, but it took 7 seconds to get there.

It would seem - decide on the fastest you want to go on the throttle (you can always boost it with afterburner) - find an engine that can achieve that at IDS x5 and save the build capacity of having a lower class engine for other things!!

MMaggio · Post by **MMaggio** » Wed May 11, 2011 6:16 pm

You know, I really thought the higher engine would give you better accelleration. I am surprised that this is not the fact, It appears that the smallest engine is as good as the best. I see no advantage.
Perhaps Vice will look into this flaw.

Post by **DaveK** » Wed May 11, 2011 9:02 pm

The advantage is the top speed just using the throttle - on a StarMaster max speed with a class 1 engine is less than 250m/s - IDS multiplier brings this up to around 1250m/s. With a Class 10 engine at x5 I can get approaching 2200 without using the afterburner. According to the engine data a class 5 engine increases the unmultipled speed by 132m/s and a class 10 by almost 300m's. Using a 5x IDS multiplier that bocomes 660 and 1500 respectively. The base speed of a talon is 560 and the base speed of a StarMaster is 243 so unless I want to limp round a system a bigger engine is better.

I am not suprised that the acceleration doesn't change though.

If Vice was to include acceleration (a) he would have to take the engine thrust (based on engine class) this is the force (F) it produces and the mass of the ship (m) which would depend on all the add-ons it has plus the amount of fuel, cargo etc it is carrying and use a=F/m to determine the acceleration. This would change (though probably minimally) as fuel is used up but would vary with cargo and the various add-ons we all love so much.

[Edited on 11-5-2011 by DaveK]

[Edited on 11-5-2011 by DaveK]

[Edited on 11-5-2011 by DaveK]

Post by **DaveK** » Thu May 12, 2011 7:03 am

Having thought a bit . . .

fix the mass of the ship at the typical loadout for that frame. Then ignore changes in fuel, cargo etc. Justification: the mass of the frame would be large compared to any individual add-on and the masses "types" of add-on wouldn't change much (all missiles would weigh around the same compared to the mass of the frame) Then there would be a fixed mass for the ship (depending just on the frame type) - engines have a fixed max thrust anyway so the acceleration calculation becomes much easier . . . .

except the amount of throttle used would have to be taken into account - the thrust would vary smoothly (or it could be ramped up in steps for simplicity) from none to fully open.

Not an accurate acceleration but better then at present when a tiny engine accelerates a massive frame as quickly as a massive engine accelerates a tiny frame, the only difference being the point at which it can't accelerate it any more.

There was a thread several months ago about acceleration - the gist was that the ship should continue to accelerate until it ran out of fuel (proper newtonian physics) but the limits Vice put in were to make the game balanced and playable. - Some were in favour of PvP @ 10 000mps or more!

I prefer to live within the limts - It will be fun balancing max speed against other goodies (more manouverable wings for example or a bigger fuel tank for exploring) I would rather have a ship that I can fly and concentrate on doing other things rather than a really very realistic physics system where you would spend more time just trying to keep the ship where you want it go!

(there is a very accurate shuttle simulator that you can spend weeks just learning to pilot the launching and getting the thing into a stable(ish) orbit - it's an eye opener about a "proper" newtonian simulation!)

Commander Wilmot · Post by **Commander Wilmot** » Sat May 28, 2011 11:28 pm

Interesting findings, but what is the thrust value for, then? Cosmetics?

Jack Dandy · Post by **Jack Dandy** » Sun May 29, 2011 3:39 am

Pretty sure that higher thrust = The afterburner gives you speed faster.