Crowd Funding .. How about DLC Packs

[Bullock]

I just found this game recently and I love it. Great game play, both straight forward and interesting. Enjoyable flight model as well.

I am a big supporter of the Star Citizen project as many of you may be as well. However, I would love to see this games publisher have an opportunity to add content and get paid for it.

I would support a crowd funding project for this title to add more high end game goals, such as ... (keep in mind I only have about 15 hours of play in it so far, but plan to keep playing).

1) Being able to place Star Gates (Really Expensive = 2 Billion each or more.)
2) Being able to fly capitals (Again Pricey at over 2 Billion each)
3) Random list of very hard to buy items, but cool items, maybe a scanner that helps find unknown locations that costs 10 billion to buy and takes up 5 equipment slots.
4) Fix the serious balance issue that favors station trading far too much as a vocation. in any other game it would be considered a heavy exploit and really sort of takes most or all of the fun out of playing this game for the long term.

I'm sure more seasoned players can come up with a load of ideas, but the point is, a publisher needs support to add value with a bit less risk, since it's just a very small programming team.

The point is to add LARGER end game goals to work for, so trading doesn't just mean a larger number in the bank, but working for 5 billion can actually get you a star gate to SOL or an epic battle with cap ships.

Fun stuff, and count me in for the Crowd Funding when/if it happens. I think the game is worth the investment. With the crowd funding model, each player can contribute what they can afford.

[Edited on 8-30-2014 by Bullock]

[Marvin]

You can do that anyway ... simply by purchasing a dozen key codes.

[Bullock]

You can do that anyway ... simply by purchasing a dozen key codes.

Well, the point is to get the DLC out of it, not 12 copies of the same game with the same features. You can call it a pre-order DLC pack.

There is just no point to ask for more updates or features to enhance the same game and expect that the programmer will have time to do it without getting paid.

As an example, I'm into Star Citizen for about $700 all together, and wouldn't mind adding a $100 to this game for updates.

[Edited on 8-27-2014 by Bullock]

[Edited on 8-27-2014 by Bullock]

[CS-ACI-]

Hello,

I just found this game recently and I love it. Great game play, both straight forward and interesting. Enjoyable flight model as well.

I am a big supporter of the Star Citizen project as many of you may be as well. However, I would love to see this games publisher have an opportunity to add content and get paid for it.

I would support a crowd funding project for this title to add more high end game goals, such as ... (keep in mind I only have about 15 hours of play in it so far, but plan to keep playing).

1) Being able to place Star Gates (Really Expensive = 2 Billion each or more.)
2) Being able to fly capitals (Again Pricey at over 2 Billion each)
3) Random list of very hard to buy items, but cool items, maybe a scanner that helps find unknown locations that costs 10 billion to buy and takes up 5 equipment slots.

I'm sure more seasoned players can come up with a load of ideas, but the point is, a publisher needs support to add value with a bit less risk, since it's just a very small programming team.

The point is to add LARGER end game goals to work for, so trading doesn't just mean a larger number in the bank, but working for 5 billion can actually get you a star gate to SOL or an epic battle with cap ships.

Fun stuff, and count me in for the Crowd Funding when/if it happens. I think the game is worth the investment. With the crowd funding model, each player can contribute what they can afford.

Whilst we would all like to have Capital Ships, and be able to build our own Star Gates, what you are suggesting is a "Pay to Win" idea. You want too change the balance of the game by making it not about playing the game but about how much real cash you can spend.

If I remember correctly and nothing has changed, the developer is a one man operation with the help and feed back of players. He has developed a game that we like, I can only speak directly for my self but have purchased several versions.

I like the fact that everyone starts off the same, we all have to learn the same things, we all have to earn bigger ships, bigger guns, bigger missiles, more equipment and crew.

I am currently at about 9 hours playing time in EM ( from the clock below the compass ) and earning credits ( about 30M every 5 mins depending on mission ) and doing missions so I am now at about 400M credits with a full crew, the biggest ship configured for maximum profit.

Steve

[Bullock]

Hello,

Whilst we would all like to have Capital Ships, and be able to build our own Star Gates, what you are suggesting is a "Pay to Win" idea. You want too change the balance of the game by making it not about playing the game but about how much real cash you can spend.

If I remember correctly and nothing has changed, the developer is a one man operation with the help and feed back of players. He has developed a game that we like, I can only speak directly for my self but have purchased several versions.

I like the fact that everyone starts off the same, we all have to learn the same things, we all have to earn bigger ships, bigger guns, bigger missiles, more equipment and crew.

I am currently at about 9 hours playing time in EM ( from the clock below the compass ) and earning credits ( about 30M every 5 mins depending on mission ) and doing missions so I am now at about 400M credits with a full crew, the biggest ship configured for maximum profit.

Steve
[/rrquote]

Hey Steve,

I don't know where you got the Pay 2 Win idea from my post. I was talking about add on DLC expansions (you know more content) to make the game better. As it is right now, although the game is an interesting journey of trading and such, it has very little endgame high end goals to it. As you've stated, you have the best ship, etc... and have only played 9 hours... Alright, what are you going to do with your 400m? Not much more to do when you hit 5 Billion.. So no big goals.. Otherwise a great game to be honest. Perhaps you can just re-read what I wrote and see where I missed it. From my limited experience this game is more a solo game than MP game, although I've logged on the hosts, but they seem to be for goofing around.

[CS-ACI-]

Hello,

Hey Steve,

I don't know where you got the Pay 2 Win idea from my post. I was talking about add on DLC expansions (you know more content) to make the game better. As it is right now, although the game is an interesting journey of trading and such, it has very little endgame high end goals to it. As you've stated, you have the best ship, etc... and have only played 9 hours... Alright, what are you going to do with your 400m? Not much more to do when you hit 5 Billion.. So no big goals.. Otherwise a great game to be honest. Perhaps you can just re-read what I wrote and see where I missed it. From my limited experience this game is more a solo game than MP game, although I've logged on the hosts, but they seem to be for goofing around.

Sorry if you mis-understood what I mean, in this game you have to earn everything in the game, not pay a little extra to get it. If Capital ships become available for everyone or the ability to build Star Gates, it would be because the players of the game wanted it and enough of them asked Vice to add them. Then everyone would have the chance to have them not just those with extra real cash.

As for the 400M, between these two posts I played and added another 100M. I do have an advantage over someone who has just started playing EM from scratch as I have played several of the previous games. This means I know how to make credits quickly and where to do this and how to get there.

A little story of my advance

As for the amount of credits 400M or 500M is still not much, without spoiling it for you here is a quick explanation of my current goals.

I am in the only completely safe part of the Evochron Universe.

I am running between two space stations trading, I only have a license at one of them.

I have all four crew members at 100% loyalty, 3 at 100 and the last at 91% training.

I want to amass about 1.5B credits as it is easy to spend.
A - crew cost currently about 20K every 90 ticks.
B - station storage, not used yet but will be and it costs plenty.
C - hanger space, not used yet but will be and it costs plenty.
D - paying for mercenaries, costs plenty and I/you will need them later.
E - cost of building stations.

Once I am in a good credit position I shall start the quests, this will lead me onto more equipment and challenges.

If you look around the forum you will find extra challenges made by players.

Then there is also the added level of PvP either CO-OP or direct action ( always by consent ) where each player will have his/her own configuration of ship and weapons.

Now the above is only half the game as far as I am concerned as it is only the civilian side, the is also a military side. Once you start on the military path you lose your crew IF I remember correctly. So because of this I wish to complete all quests before I swap across to the military path.

Steve

[Marvin]

The latest release of EM allows you to keep your crew when in a military ship ... they go into storage. One explanation for how this is done can be found in the H2GE.

[CS-ACI-]

Hello,

The latest release of EM allows you to keep your crew when in a military ship ... they go into storage. One explanation for how this is done can be found in the H2GE.

Fantastic, even with the experience I have I am still learning.

Another reason the quests are important.

Steve


[Edited on 8-28-2014 by CS-ACI-]

[SeeJay]

Funding to keep Vice working on new features that all players can access without paying extra is one thing. I could do that.

Funding (Pre-Order) a DLC pack is Pay to Win since not all players can afford it. I do not like Pay to Win games.

I also like some aspects of the upcoming Star Citizen but I will not pay a dime until I can test a Demo. (That goes for any game)
Why?
For one, the game might not even hit the market. It has happened before.
There also seam to be a lot of cut-scenes, auto docking, not able to descend and fly around in atmosphere etc. I do not like that at all.

It looks like it will be a pay to win game as well, but I'm not sure about that one. Just my opinion by reading their forum.

[Bullock]

Funding to keep Vice working on new features that all players can access without paying extra is one thing. I could do that.

Funding (Pre-Order) a DLC pack is Pay to Win since not all players can afford it. I do not like Pay to Win games.

Seejay, first off "much respect" for your obvious contribution to this game.

with that said, your above opinion and the other one in this thread aren't really in line with what this game appears to be, and what it is not.

1) It's not an MMO, it's a solo game with a 34 player hosted MP option. Just host w/DLC, host w/o DLC.... no balance issue, old vets just play your same game... new DLC players move on to more content they payed for.
2) Time is money. New content costs money. If you can't afford a DLC, play your same game.... enjoy. Save up for new DLC pack.

Really, it's sad that a game like Elite got Millions for making a game that is already here for the most part in EM. This game needs more passionate supporters who understand that time is money.

Done beating a dead horse... reminds me of the EVE forums, truly... I was born in this whole and I'll die in this hole.....

All in good fun though.

[MiaZ]

I just found this game recently and I love it. Great game play, both straight forward and interesting. Enjoyable flight model as well.

I am a big supporter of the Star Citizen project as many of you may be as well. However, I would love to see this games publisher have an opportunity to add content and get paid for it.

I would support a crowd funding project for this title to add more high end game goals, such as ... (keep in mind I only have about 15 hours of play in it so far, but plan to keep playing).

1) Being able to place Star Gates (Really Expensive = 2 Billion each or more.)
2) Being able to fly capitals (Again Pricey at over 2 Billion each)
3) Random list of very hard to buy items, but cool items, maybe a scanner that helps find unknown locations that costs 10 billion to buy and takes up 5 equipment slots.

I'm sure more seasoned players can come up with a load of ideas, but the point is, a publisher needs support to add value with a bit less risk, since it's just a very small programming team.

The point is to add LARGER end game goals to work for, so trading doesn't just mean a larger number in the bank, but working for 5 billion can actually get you a star gate to SOL or an epic battle with cap ships.

Fun stuff, and count me in for the Crowd Funding when/if it happens. I think the game is worth the investment. With the crowd funding model, each player can contribute what they can afford.

I like the ideas ,1 2 and 3 and I would pay for updates for these things.
The words DLC is kind of a dirty word though it seems.

Some ideas for MP I had too but MP is gone really quiet these days : (

If vice is planning to add content I am very willing to pay for an expansion to the game.
In fact when the last expansion come out I was expecting to have to pay for it but it was free upgrade for those who already had the game.

This is one of the few games that I would pay up front for an expansion.








[Edited on 8-28-2014 by MiaZ]

[SeeJay]

I don't mind paying for new cool stuff for the game.

If it is to be like DLC, that would work for SP play only since we all have to use the same version
in MP for it to be a fair game.
I only play in MP and if you can't join a server because you have a DLC installed, the already small
amount of MP players would be even smaller.

I would rather it to be an expansion. I would gladly pay for that.
Like Miaz, I was very surprised when Vice released the EM2 free of charge.

Hope to see you out there Bullock.

[Marvin]

I'm with SeeJay and MiaZ on this. And I think I can see why Vice made the EM's expansion a freebie: MP. As SeeJay indicated, MP and SP are interchangeable in EM ... a concept which would be tossed out the window if any kind of upgrade was restricted to those players who paid for it. I'd prefer to purchase a totally new incarnation.

[PaulB]

I really like that we can make suggestions and request and Vice reads them and implements some of them.
There are so many dead and dieing projects around, PPG, Vegastrike, and others, but EM seems to keep going though I am a bit depressed on the status of MP in recent months - even though I have internet issues being able to do MP reliably. I would like to and it's sad that the world times zone differnces makes is so hard or those of us who post here have it hard getting on MP and compatible times fo us all.

I like EM and I'm glad my back is letting me get back in the game (knock on wood).

Seems there are a few folkd lately that have move on or something - I haven't seen Rubber Chicken for a couple of months and little of Cindy.

[DaveK]

With no comments about whether the ideas are good or not . . .

1) Being able to place Star Gates (Really Expensive = 2 Billion each or more.)
2) Being able to fly capitals (Again Pricey at over 2 Billion each)
3) Random list of very hard to buy items, but cool items, maybe a scanner that helps find unknown locations that costs 10 billion to buy and takes up 5 equipment slots.

pop up fairly regularly as 'what I'd love to see' requests . . . and generate a fairly constant pro versus con series of arguments based around what they would do to gameplay and play balance.

EM is a one (super)man project done for love not profit (hence for example the Expansion being offered free of charge so that all players regardless of financial assets could continue to play MP as well as SP). Vice responds to the community's suggestions after they have been thrashed out and as long as they are feasible and fit in with his vision for the future of the game/series.

A quick search on any or all of the three suggestions is quite interesting and educational!

[Bullock]

At least we're talking..

Stargates was the first thing that popped in my head for this game as a natural extension for exploration.

The big downside to it would be at some point you could map the game with stargates, but that would take a long time. Yet, it would be a very good group goal as well if it were multi player..

From what I've observed with this player base is , no one is out to get anyone else and it would seem that all who play sort of balance each other out. The fact that you can just play solo and still keep your stuff is sort of a cheat anyway. Already, I've bought items on SP and sold them on MP since I got more for them.

When I get into a game, I tend to read the forums for days and see the past of where the game has been. It's a very interesting read.

Anyways, I'm new and excited about the game and am more than willing to add a few hundred dollars to expand the ENDGAME content, of which I think this game is lacking. As mentioned, really big costly goals with very cool benefits. So to place a stargate would take 2 billion or around 20 to 40 hours of play time.. so not easy, but still a very worthy goal.

Perhaps with enough support, Vice could be convinced to start making a profit on this game and get a list of do-able features that could be done and see what gets the votes and support.

Best

[Marvin]

Actually, this game has so many defenders of the galaxy that it's hard to find a good brawl these days (unless it's been scheduled in advance). As for stargates (long range jump gates), I'm one of those who would welcome them ... especially considering how many star systems can be found out beyond the gated community. I'd also like to see (or build) an evoverse totally void of anything man-made until players decide to build it. Jump gates, trade stations ... even cities.

[CS-ACI-]

Hello,

From what I've observed with this player base is , no one is out to get anyone else and it would seem that all who play sort of balance each other out. The fact that you can just play solo and still keep your stuff is sort of a cheat anyway. Already, I've bought items on SP and sold them on MP since I got more for them.

You have actually stumbled across one of the many aspects of the game that we like, sometimes you will see a player post a message asking for help like this, normally fuel.

But if you look around, you can normally find a better place to sell too make a profit.

I have only mined to make original purchases and to build enough credits to buy one license which gives me about 25% discount when buying stuff.

Steve

[DaveK]

Anyways, I'm new and excited about the game and am more than willing to add a few hundred dollars to expand the ENDGAME content, of which I think this game is lacking.

I've been playing a while and I'm still excited about the game!

As a totally open sandbox game, I'm not sure what it would mean to have an endgame content, never mind an expanded one.

What would you do after the endgame stuff had been achieved? Or do you mean more things to do/find/explore within the game?

[Marvin]

Vice is always working to expand the end game ... to kick the can down the road, so to speak. Which is probably why he welcomes suggestions.

[DaveK]

Vice is always working to expand the end game ... to kick the can down the road, so to speak. Which is probably why he welcomes suggestions.

So endgame activities are/include . . .

• becoming a Legend
• becoming a Fleet Admiral
• maintaining as many clan systems as you want to
• getting rich enough not to have to worry about $$$
• finding more and more 'uncharted' systems
• researching the answers to any Evoverse mysteries that intrigue you
• landing on earth in one piece
• creating quests
• writing Evoverse stories

etc etc etc ??

So the answer to my question . . . Or do you mean more things to do/find/explore within the game? . . . is yes?

Then if so, I'm all in favour!

[Bullock]

Vice is always working to expand the end game ... to kick the can down the road, so to speak. Which is probably why he welcomes suggestions.

So endgame activities are/include . . .

• becoming a Legend
• becoming a Fleet Admiral
• maintaining as many clan systems as you want to
• getting rich enough not to have to worry about $$$
• finding more and more 'uncharted' systems
• researching the answers to any Evoverse mysteries that intrigue you
• landing on earth in one piece
• creating quests
• writing Evoverse stories

etc etc etc ??

So the answer to my question . . . Or do you mean more things to do/find/explore within the game? . . . is yes?

Then if so, I'm all in favour!

All very worthy goals, however.

1) I found out within two hours of playing that money is not balanced with activity. Mining was fun, until you realize you just can get a license in any station or build one and just trade 20 to 25% profits back and forth from stations within the same system, making 10's of millions in minutes.
2) Shooting ships is fun, but the loot gained is again not balanced with trading or even mining. There are no bounties on bad guys, so there is little value in game overall to pick a trade, other than trading.
3) Exploring could be fun and I plan to make the SOL journey, but from my understanding it could be from hours to a 100 hours to get there, and that's for just one system. not counting getting back. So it's obvious how a Jump gate placement feature would be very useful to explore the whole galaxy. Without it, it's just too big a time investment for a game. If I could place a jump gate, then perhaps I could use it to trade on a regular basis with that far away land; and that would be enough motive to desire to do it for another system or more. As is, it would be very unlikely I would leave the hub that often as it's just too much time involved for each trip.
4) I get notices in the coms for stranded ships, needed supplies and containers, but again the balance is so far off from trading, it leaves little reason to do it after that first time for fun; same with missions, although they can get standings rewards if you're a mission runner.


I really love the way the ships fly and the general layout of the universe and jump gate system. I bought the Arvoch game as well, but don't like missions nearly as much as a sandbox. The game is pretty really, just doesn't have a motive to keep playing it. There should be costly jump gates so you can build your own network and even more important is occupational balance VS reward for things to do in the game. Trading shouldn't be the only thing to do that will earn you money. After a few hours I had 600 Million.

The community is very nice here as well, so that's why I would even bother posting.

The reality is it is very unlikely a gamer will stay with this game long enough to enjoy the unknown features unless there is a means to create his or her own universe of connecting the dots, trade routes, exploration and even wars.

Just my thoughts after 22 hours of game play. I've played every Space sim, and when it's all said and done, it's all about desire to do it.... Making trading so ridiculously easy makes no sense, unless I get to do something wonderful with the money I earn... but fix the vocational balance as well though.

That's why I created this thread to promote a funding method for a DLC that would make a more balanced game with rewarding solo player endgame goals.

Best.

[Edited on 8-29-2014 by Bullock]

[Busch]

Well, there are several methods for arriving in Sol system. The long way being the action of entering -1050/0/-5050 in the NavCon, toggling ENTER, toggling Alt-F2, and hoping for the best..... Major fuel pod capacity and/or build-deploy constructors as ships' equipment, may be a concern for this method. Check alternate sources like SeeJay's website(s) for info sources. Or, ask game-wired AI pilots, or bribe them for information. It's like a box of chocolates - ye jist never know whatcher gonna git! Or wormholes, or blackholes, or wormholes inside of blackholes. Or jump gates that aren't all that advertised... Or, ask a Vet!

[CS-ACI-]

Hello,

3) Exploring could be fun and I plan to make the SOL journey, but from my understanding it could be from hours to a 100 hours to get there, and that's for just one system. not counting getting back. So it's obvious how a Jump gate placement feature would be very useful to explore the whole galaxy. Without it, it's just too big a time investment for a game. If I could place a jump gate, then perhaps I could use it to trade on a regular basis with that far away land; and that would be enough motive to desire to do it for another system or more. As is, it would be very unlikely I would leave the hub that often as it's just too much time involved for each trip.
[Edited on 8-29-2014 by Bullock]

I will deal with this one point alone.

Having played before and completed the Quests, I knew how to get too Sol. In the fan fiction I am writing ( I am not a writer so it could be a lot better ) I started a new profile for the character. As the story says, I was at my home ( Sol not named in the story ) in three hours, in the original ship with just larger fuel tanks needed, 1,200 units of fuel approx. If I had upgraded the Jump Drive I could have made the journey 5 times faster, but not so good for the plot line. The first time I made this journey it took several days after I had completed the Quest to find what the Quest eludes too.

There are many short cuts, some are earned and some not. Earning the knowledge is much better than it just being given too you.

You seem to be learning the tricks too earn credits quickly, it is only a small part of the game. It is handy to build your bank balance up so you don't need to worry about it all the time. But as you move around and buy station licenses, you will find that they become very very expensive, you could get to a situation where your paying 50+M for each one. Having at least one per system is always handy for a safe haven.

As for the need for extra player made Jump Gates, no need.

To get to Sol there is a Worm Hole, and to get back there is another Worm Hole but hard to find and it puts you back in Pearl.

Follow the Quests and save often, really often, if you get stranded somewhere ask for help, sometimes you will need to jump on to a server so someone can rescue you. Some of us keep a spare profile just for this purpose, players can sell each other fuel and anything else in cargo bays.

Steve

[Marvin]

As for the need for extra player made Jump Gates, no need.

On this point I must disagree. IM has two territories which are located off the beaten path. One of them is a 20-minute trip with a Mantis drive and the other ... well, Titto pretty much keeps that system up to speed by himself. If we could purchase and position our own jumpgates* then it would be a lot easier to maintain our current territory and even expand into other, currently unexplored, systems.

* Either that or find some container hidden far out in the boondocks filled with extremely long-range hyper-drives ... the kind which uses 3x the fuel but, heck, it's a trade-off.