[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) *INFO*

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:18 am

I have recently set up a server and got it listed in the global server list. All (seemed) to be well - players can connect correctly and play. However it seems that players are being disconnected every time they leave a base.

I have checked the server's connection and all is running well - there is nothing I can see that would be causing such an issue other than a game bug. The version of the server program I am using is up-to-date, since I downloaded it fresh from the site yesterday.

The client game is the latest EM, bought from Steam - so I assume is always up-to-date.

Has anyone had this before? If so, how can it be fixed?

I appreciate any help you can give me. Thanks.

[Edited on 19-9-2013 by jimbobslimbob]

Post by **Marvin** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:34 pm

That's a new one. If the game is Mercenaries, you might try downloading the sever program from here:

http://www.starwraith.com/evochronmerce ... nloads.htm

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:42 pm

It is indeed Evochron Mercenary. As stated, I downloaded the server program from the link you gave me yesterday - so it is bang up to date. Client version was running from a Steam-bought copy of the game.

I am really at a loss on this one, since other than that issue, the connection is good and there are no other issues.

I would appreciate some help on the matter. Maybe some others could try connecting and seeing if they have the same issue? Server is named "Brickage" on the list, or you can connect directly using www.jimbobslimbob.com as the "IP Address".

EDIT: do not add the http:// on the front of the above address - this forum seems to do that automatically.

[Edited on 19-9-2013 by jimbobslimbob]

Post by **Vice** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:51 pm

I tested it and it worked fine for me entering and exiting the station in Arvoch. The only thing that comes to mind as a possible cause would be some form of disk access issue that is blocking or otherwise interfering with the server program's ability to save certain gamestate data to the hard drive. That's the only related event I can think of that could result in a player getting dropped when they attempt to leave a station. So I would check to make sure that the server program has full permission to write to its own folder first and that there isn't anything else running in the background that would hinder the performance of the program writing to the hard drive. If the server program is blocked from saving data to the hard drive like it needs to, it could result in a delay that would drop players. But it may also be some kind of client-side issue since the server seems to be working properly when I tested it. Especially if it's just one player that's encountered the problem.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:51 pm

Thanks for the help I will look into this further, although the fact that both you and I have no issues with it makes me think it is a client side issue with his game. I will ask him to do an uninstall and reinstall to see if that fixes it.

Thanks again!

Post by **Vice** » Thu Sep 19, 2013 6:23 pm

And if it persists, have him contact me via e-mail for direct support (starwraith.com > contact). He can follow the steps here to prepare a msinfo report on his system: http://www.starwraith.com/evochronmercenary/faq.htm#8

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:07 am

Will do, thanks for the help.

I have let him know the situation and if the problem still occurs after a re-install I will direct him to that.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:26 am

Hello again,

Thought I would update you on the problem as it stands so far.

I got the guy who was being disconnected frequently to completely uninstall and re-install the game and we tested it out a bit over the weekend. It seems that it was not just disconnecting him when he left bases (as I previously thought), this may have just been coincidence.

It also appears that he is not the only one having this problem. Players seem to just disconnect randomly at times ranging from 10 minutes up to an hour or so. Sometimes the server console even sees them re-connecting before they have "disconnected". Weird, I know.

I also found that if I connect to the server via an internal LAN address, I have absolutely no problems. If I connect to the game via the server listing then I too, am subject to these disconnections.

I know what you are thinking - it's the server's internet line. I can tell you it's not. I have been monitoring ping and speeds all over the weekend and it has been consistently good across the board. In addition, I would like to note that the server had previously hosted other games (such as Alien Swarm, Freelancer, Garry's Mod and Battlefield 2) without any issues what-so-ever.

Browsing the forums I cam across a few threads regarding similar issues but did not find a solid solution in any of them. So, I am at a loss as to where to go from here.

Is the server program just a little temperamental? Is there any way of getting more information on exactly what is happening? What should I be looking for to fix this issue?

Thank-you for your on-going help and I hope I can get this resolved soon.

Post by **Vice** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:19 am

I am not aware of any disconnect issues that are caused by or otherwise a result of the server program itself. Other disconnect issues have been related to unreliable internet connections (either client or server side), unreliable wireless connections, and/or ISP failures. If the problem is across the internet and not on your LAN, I would focus the search on what is happening through the various relay points through your internet connection. Lost packets/intermittent signal loss on your internet connection would be a likely cause. The server program won't tolerate significant signal/packet loss, so it's a good place to start. Check to see if any information is displayed at a disconnect event (such as numbers in parenthesis). If so, that could provide some additional details regarding other possible causes. If no details are provided, then it's likely just an intermittent signal/disconnect issue. What wasn't a problem before may be something new with the connection. You can also sign in to any of the other servers currently running to test how your connection performs as a client with their connections.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:21 am

I run speed and latency monitors on the server 24/7 (and have done for years). If there is a connection problem it is clearly only being "seen" by this game. It seems more logical to me that whatever threshold the packet loss/disconnection threshold is set at, is a little too unforgiving. Perhaps this is something of a feature that could be added? Like, say, a line in the config that sets a tolerance level for this kind of thing?

Anyway, I am liaising with a few other players to test the connections to their individual systems in a little more depth. I will report back when I know more.

Capt_Caveman · Post by **Capt_Caveman** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:49 pm

I just played for 10 min or so with no problem on your server

try a trace route between you and your friends ip
look for any node with high packet loss

Post by **Vice** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:10 pm

The way the program and multiplayer module are set up, it's pretty forgiving. You'd have to be dropping enough packets to impact gamestate significantly and/or severe signal delays longer than about 4 seconds. It's likely an unreliable relay/node somewhere in your connection (see below). But here are some other things to check:

- Are you using the 3D program or the 2D program? Have you tried using the other program just to see if the behavior changes at all?

- Is there anything else running on the server system that could be interfering with the server program running consistently and/or your internet connection? That is, anything else that might be downloading, updating, uploading, or taking task focus?

- Does the chatlog display any details directly above or below the disconnect message?

- Is your internet connection being used for anything else other than hosting when a disconnect occurs?

- When multiple players are on, is only one player disconnected or all of them simultaneously?

- If you can pinpoint a series of player actions or events that take place right before a disconnect, that may help in the hunt. For example, if it's more common while coming out of a station, exactly what the player did in the station preceeding the disconnect.

- I'd be interested in learning more about your setup, including the modem/router, ISP, and system details. On the system side of things, a msinfo report can be prepared following the steps here: http://www.starwraith.com/evochronmercenary/faq.htm#8

I ran some tests to your server and did find a 29% packet loss rate during a session this morning at node nrth-bb-1b-ae11-0.network.virginmedia.net (IP 62.253.174.109). That would easily be significant enough to lose players periodically over the internet. It means you'd be losing nearly 1/3 of the data packets at that node during this test cycle. Here is the PingPlotter result:

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:14 am

Thanks again for your help. I will be running some more tests over the next couple of days. I will get all the data together and report back later in the week.

Post by **Vice** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:27 am

I ran some additional tests and encountered more lost packet problems, this time at different nodes. The related nrth-bb-1c-ae4-0 had a 10% loss and the colc-cmts-07-gigaether-141 node had a 33% loss. The first isn't too serious, but the other one is. There certainly seems to be some reliability issues with their network that could explain the disconnect problems you've been having.

On a related note, after some google searches, it appears other gamers have reported the same kind of signal problems and packet loss issues recently with the same ISP (Virgin Media) in other games, including World of Warcraft, EVE Online, and Guild Wars 2. Intermittent lag spikes, harmed gamestate, and disconnecting.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:46 am

Wow! Thanks for that, you really do go the extra mile there don't ya :-)

I really appreciate the help.

I don't suppose you have links to any of these reports you could share with me? If it is indeed some kind of intermittent network fault with Virgin I would like some evidence to back me up when I speak with them (alongside my own - which I am collating at this very moment).

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 12:17 pm

My initial findings seem to echo what you have found, Vice.

I have tested the connection from 3 different machines, on 3 different ISPs.

Machines / ISPs used are referred to as follows:
#1 BT Internet Line Machine
#2 Claranet Internet Line Machine
#3 Virgin Media (business line) Machine

All machines are set to traceroute to www.jimbobslimbob.com at 15 second intervals. All have been left running for at least 5 hours.

- On #1 I get fairly good connection, across the board, through all 16 hops. No packet losses, with the occasional high latency.
- On #2 I get similar results to the above through all 13 hops, but with the occasional packet loss (under 1% over 5 hours) on two of the nodes - both of which are Virgin Media nodes.
- On #3 things get interesting. I repeatedly get packet losses (1-4%) on Virgin Media nodes. This one is only going through 5 hops as well!

So, in summary, it doesn't seem so bad as what you have been seeing (so far) from your end, but is still not quite right.

I have since, posted on the Virgin Media forums to see if they can be of any help, but their customer service is awful so I am dreading all the "hoops" I am going to have to go through with this.

As such, I shan't bother you anymore with this issue until I have something more to say (one way or the other) and have at least heard back from them.

I want to thank you again for your help. I really do appreciate it, and I just wish that technical support for a game/service was like this everywhere. I will have only good things to say about my experiences so far.

Keep up the great work!

Capt_Caveman · Post by **Capt_Caveman** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:35 pm

google "nrth-bb-1b-ae11-0 packet loss"

Post by **Vice** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 4:33 pm

The google search Capt referred to will offer references to the problem in other games. Looks like League of Legends and World of Tanks might be others with similar reported issues on the same node (along with others). Could be that the problem is more frequent during peak times, but it's tough to say for sure. I've also e-mailed you a copy of the other pingplotter test I ran.

It wouldn't be surprising if the problem was in the 1-5% range over a long period of time, with intervals of fairly reliable performance. However, since players generally join and play for shorter periods of time, a 20-30% packet loss rate over a shorter interval could result in a high chance of being disconnected. I ran the tests over a fairly short duration, kind of emulating how a player might connect and stay on for several minutes until they encountered a disconnect/packet loss problem. The result was a problem often surfaced within 10 minutes of me signing on, maybe about 1/3 of the time, very close to the 30% packet loss failure rate reported on at least one node within that period of time.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 7:19 am

Just thought I would update you on this:

I had a Virgin Engineer over on Friday, who amongst other things replaced my HUB, checked the line thoroughly and played about with the settings. Nothing is wrong. I get a constant, brilliant Ping Test result. I get a constant, brilliant Speed Test. I get a constant, brilliant Ping throughout the day. The ONLY thing that shows the slightest issue is when performing traceroutes.

But, all of this does not add up - because all a traceroute is, is a ping, to different "stages" of the connection - yet the ping to my server is always flawless (which is, what matters). As such I am really at a loss as to where to go with this now - since other than Evochron, absolutely everything else works flawlessly and Virgin are denying there is anything wrong.

Moreover, I have tried both the 2D and 3D versions of the server program with no difference whatsoever.

Post by **DaveK** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:20 am

From post: 164547, Topic: tid=10990, author=jimbobslimbob wrote:My initial findings seem to echo what you have found, Vice.

I have tested the connection from 3 different machines, on 3 different ISPs.

Machines / ISPs used are referred to as follows:
#1 BT Internet Line Machine
#2 Claranet Internet Line Machine
#3 Virgin Media (business line) Machine

All machines are set to traceroute to http://www.jimbobslimbob.com at 15 second intervals. All have been left running for at least 5 hours.

- On #3 things get interesting. I repeatedly get packet losses (1-4%) on Virgin Media nodes. This one is only going through 5 hops as well!

I have since, posted on the Virgin Media forums to see if they can be of any help, but their customer service is awful so I am dreading all the "hoops" I am going to have to go through with this.

I'm on Virgin Media cable and get kicked fairly regularly even from Galactica (ping 30 - 40 and in the same country!! (UK))

Frequent saves and chanting relaxing mantra's are the closest to a solution I've found; the really frustrating bit it that I get disconnected but am only told about it when I try to do something major - like trade in a station, so I might be 'by myself' for 20 minutes before I find out!

Like you I find getting VM 'help' to be as frustrating as sourcing hens' teeth and unicorn horns.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:41 am

While it is nice to know that I am not alone, it does not fill me with confidence with Virgin.

The amount of tosh I have had to go through with them over the last week and not once have I had any explanation or acknowledgement to the problems I have been having.

Thing is, my recent findings have only made it more difficult to determine the "problem", since I am stumped and Virgin are simply useless.

Result: Is it time for a new ISP? Sky? Plusnet? Is it even an ISP issue? I literally don't have a clue what to do next.

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 12:30 pm

In addition to my posts today, if anyone is interested, you can check out my thread on the Virgin forums here.. As of writing this it's about 3 pages long, with pretty much naff all response from Virgin other than "We will send out an engineer".

Capt_Caveman · Post by **Capt_Caveman** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 1:15 pm

good ping does not reflect connection quality.
a different isp may help but you might find your traffic still gets routed thru the same bad virgin mobile node.

I have the same problem with my server (CAV)
a couple players are routed thru a bad node
and there's nothing I can do about it.

[Edited on 9-30-2013 by capt_cronic]

jimbobslimbob · Post by **jimbobslimbob** » Mon Sep 30, 2013 2:01 pm

I appreciate the help from everyone on this forum. It seems odd that a forum dedicated to a game is infinitely better than my actual ISP at working out the problems I have been having... with my ISP!

I have given Virgin until the end of this week to give me an explanation / fix. If I hear nothing from them then I will be moving ISP. Even if this doesn't fix the problem, due to nodes I am going through, I simply cannot accept the way Virgin have handled my problem. On that fact alone, I will be changing. They have been less than useless.

Plusnet is looking to be the best deal for me, since even though I am with Sky for TV - their prices are a lot higher.

Has anyone on here had any dealings with Plusnet? Are they any good?

StarWraith 3D Games Forum

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO

[EM 2.728] Players being kicked when leaving a base (ISP reliability) INFO